Text 12263, 139 rader
Skriven 2007-02-15 09:48:54 av Rob Perkins (15704.babylon5)
     Kommentar till en text av rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.moderated
Ärende: Re: Cath0licism and Creati=nism
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On 2/14/07 5:59 PM, in article 70e7t2hfgt0b396ka4g8f9bg5ge31sqenh@4ax.com,
"Josh Hill" <usereplyto@gmail.com> wrote:

>> An exaggeration. Nagin's failure was that of transporting the willing poor
>> out of harm's way. Permitting the regular imperatives of a bus drivers'
>> union from letting him act in an emergency.
> 
> I think the idea was to make it an exaggeration.

That ascribes an ulterior motive to people in power. Nagin specifically
denied transportation to the poor?

What I think is most likely is that the brownian motion inside DHS and
between DHS and the states was at the time, and still is, quite speedy.
People are still sorting out what the new organization means. The current
federal power base is unpleasantly draconian, and dismayed that people
aren't going along with *this* fight against tyranny nearly as eagerly as
they did after Pearl Harbor.

(I think it has something to do with the ubiquity of television.)

> I'm thinking a bit of smoothing is in order. The decline probably
> began under Nixon, continued under Ford and Carter, an idealist, but a
> hapless one. But it was Reagan who was the anti-Roosevelt, who purged
> from the public consciousness the idea -- amply demonstrated by the
> wonderfully successful progressive policies of the first half of the
> 20th century -- that government could make society better, that
> society could /get/ better.

There is no denying the difference Social Security and Medicare have made
for the welfare of the nation as a whole. I pay those taxes gladly and
without a lot of interest in changing the basic idea.

>>> According to the National Coalition on Health Care, "the number of
>>> excess deaths among uninsured adults age 25-64 is in the range of
>>> 18,000 a year." I don't know why the figures don't include those under
>>> 25 years of age.
>> 
>> Probably because the National Coalition on Health Care was misusing a
>> statistic. 
>> 
>> I consider it valuable to think of health care in terms of what was
>> available 40 years ago as opposed to today. 40 years ago, there wasn't a
>> health insurance industry to speak of, because there wasn't much a doctor
>> could do for something as simple as a stomach ulcer, let alone a clogged
>> artery or even adult-onset diabetes. $1000/scan MRI's were out of the
>> question; no computer could process the data fast enough. Sonograms did not
>> exist. And so forth.
> 
> Your timing's off! Which is to say I'm fogy enough to remember the
> medicine of 1967, which, while not the equal of today's, treated my
> mother's perforated ulcer (surgery)

...instead of antibiotics and an endoscopic procedure...

> and clogged arteries (venous
> bypass graft)

...instead of a stent...

> and my grandmother's adult-onset diabetes (restricted
> diet).

...instead of far more effective "miracle drugs" combined with dietary
change...

> That being said, sure, medicine has become more expensive.

I think my case is still valid, if we push the time frame into 60 years or
so. 

> Well, the flip side of that is that I've noticed a severe and shameful
> degradation in the quality of medical care since HMO's came on the
> scene and started rationing.

Yes, that's a problem too. It was interesting when I was with Kaiser to see
how easily and quickly I could get something like a rapid strep test, for no
copay, but I had to wait four hours in an exam room for an overworked doctor
to give me a prescription for something I was sure would cause a kidney
stone. 

> Sure, they come from dismal poverty to American-level poverty. This to
> me doesn't justify what's happening to our middle and working classes.

Then, there ought to be a calmer debate on the issue, rather than the
polarized and idealistic screaming
 
>> Even so, I share your hope that a positive-sum optimist will take the White
>> House. Someone like Obama might not be all that experienced, but neither was
>> Clinton, when he moved up from AR, it seems to me.
> 
> I tend to think the "experience" thing is a stand-in for "Hmmm, can we
> really trust a black dude not to screw up?"

Not in my case. And for what it's worth, there was significant concern about
Clinton's slickness, and his integrity.

> In politics, as in other work, the best performers are frequently
> /not/ the most socially engaging.

The ones who are socially engaging usually get the work, refuting your
notion that the most competent, best performers would rise to the federal
level. 

> 
>> I have the same impression about Mitt Romney. Whatever his position on this
>> or that issue, he comes across as remarkably positive. Of course I have no
>> confidence in the Republican machine to look past his religious faith during
>> the primaries. 
> 
> Sadly, from what I've read, that seems to be true.. And the man I
> regard as the strongest Republican candidate, Rudy Giuliani -- the man
> who, alone among the Democrats and Republicans in the running, seems
> to me capable of true greatness -- will probably lose because he
> favors gay rights and abortion. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

Either that or he'll cause that fractious faction to simply sit home in
November, possibly locking in a Dem victory.

The more I think about it, the more I want the evangelicals sidelined for
the next 12 years or so, unless they can play with others with greater
respect. 

Too bad, really. A Giuliani/Romney ticket would be *fascinating*. Both men
are remarkably positive, and would know how to debate Hillary Clinton Or
Barack Obama with efficiency, alacrity, and competence. The best candidate
might stand a chance of winning.

And anyone except *maybe* Clinton or McCain would have a chance at obviating
"culture war", simply by willing to listen to all factions and incorporate
good ideas from every direction, something desperately missing from the
current administration and the last Congress.

Alas, again, it's McCain's "turn", even though he's far more effective in
the Senate than he could ever be as President.

Rob
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