Text 796, 191 rader
Skriven 2006-05-26 11:28:00 av Robert E Starr JR (1242.babylon5)
Ärende: Re: Do we need artificial
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Dennis (Icarus) wrote:
> >
> >      As we "advanced" technologically as a people, we have not
> > taken care to develop a sense of responsibility for the power that has
> > come with each new paradigm in technology. By way of example take
> > gunpowder. Gunpowder can be used to help with mining, preparing to
> > build a dam, many other non-lethal uses. However it is no secret what
> > gunpowder is most often used for, guns.
>
> Guns which can be used for criminal activity, and....more importabtly, to
> defend oneself from criminals as well.

That is completely true, guns can be used to defend oneself from
criminals or even hunt for food. How does that nullify my argument that
gunpowder is most often used for guns and my obvious implication that
guns are misused?

But let ask you then since you brought the point of contrasting guns
being used for criminal activity vs. being used for defend oneself from
criminals. Which do you feel happens more often (be it in your nick of
the woods or world wide) are guns used more for good, or more for evil?
>
> >
> >      The real problem is that mankind's moral technological
> > advancements devolved in advance of our moral evolution. To make a
> > point for comparison, we are like a three year old child with our
> > father's hand gun. No where is this more true then in the misuse of
> > the internet.
> >
> >      The internet has allowed for the most unacceptable abuse of
> > children that we as a people have ever seen. Once child pornography was
> > something that extremely hard and dangerous to get a hold of. Now with
> > the misuse of the internet the most depraved people can get access to
> > it with a great deal of anonymity. This has provided a new venue for an
> > already out of control problem.
>
> So it'd seem that the kids were already being abused.
> Since these images, movies, etc apperar just as bytes (information) to the
> Internet, how can one have a medium for free exchange of information, yet
> restrict this?

You make a 100% fair question. You will note that this was a report
about "The Impact of Technology on Society". I have no idea how to fix
this problem I *never* claimed to have a solution to the problem, nor
do I now. I wish with Heaven as my witness that I did. I don't.
>
> >
> >      My argument is not that technology is in of itself evil, we have
> > just have gone too far, too fast, whereas our morals are just now
> > leaving the gate. We need to slow down and learn accountability for
> > where we are as a people.
>
> And I think the vast majority of people have greater morals than you're
> giving 'em credit for.

Fair enough, deliver some evidence to the effect that what you see on
the world scene gives you reason to think that we as a world wide (or
even in your nick of the woods) are equal in moral accountability to
where we are technologically.

Please, (and I don't mean this rhetorically) show me somthing, anything
that indicates that we, mankind are becoming morally responable for
what we doing to ourselves, and not just in ways that involve the
rhetoric we hear from Washington every time some jerk want to gain
points in the pulls. How are "we" making genuine progress? Please,
something.

I think Jon Stewart said it best in an interview he had with Larry King
a few months ago.

Taken from:
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0603/04/lkl.01.html

<snip>
>>KING: So, you don't want it to be bad?

STEWART: Did you really just ask me if I want it to be bad?

KING: Yes because you...

STEWART: What are you -- I have kids what do you think? Yes, I don't
want them to have any kind of a -- I want things to corrode to the
point where we're all living in huts.

KING: Not all living in huts but generally comics political comics like
things to go a little wrong, don't have to be the end of the world.

STEWART: Like things to go a little wrong like birdshot to the face of
a guy that will survive.

KING: That's right.

STEWART: Not like things to go wrong until it's like Mad Max, every man
for himself, let's all ride around with machineguns on, which seems to
be the way that it's...<<

Because we have a GREAT sense of personal accountability about what
cars, the products we buy, what we throw away do to the world and
mankind on the whole.

You say: "I think the vast majority of people have greater morals than
you're giving 'em credit for." There is such a mistake that is made by
so many people that think "as long as I'm not hurting someone, or
breaking a law, I'm doing good". Inaction is one of the worst things
that running through every level of society today. Inaction is (and I'm
NOT saying subjectively) is immoral. And I'm not saying that I feel I'm
not guilty of this myself.

If "the vast majority of people have greater morals than *I'm* giving
'em credit for" why is world so rife with problems? Might it be there
is a great sense of complacency and apathy in the world we live in?
>
> >
> >      It is because of this (our technological advancement vs. our moral
> > advancement) that I believe we are really less advanced then our
> > ancestors. They had ignorance as an excuse, what do we have? Also
> > remember, the most important question of all have not found any real
> > answers through technology: Who are we? Why are we here? Where do we
> > come from? Where are we going?<<
>
> What do you want? (oops...not supposed to ask that question)
> Do you have anything worth living for?
>
> <snip>
> >
> > First, the idea of putting a man on Mars is a very romantic notion,
> > it's almost as romantic  as Christopher Columbus going to America (and
> > I'm not trying to play the straw man game, I know the "Christopher
> > Columbus" parallele is my making, not yours). But what is gained from a
> > man being on Mars right now?
>
> Think of it as a unifying goal.
> One value of the ISS is that it does nicely demonstrate the cooperation
> between countries.
> After all, when the shuttle fleet was grounded....who's been providing
> supplies?
> Russia, via the Soyuz capsules.

You know, that's a very good point. One which I will concede to.

>
> >
> > And again make no mistake, if "warp drive" gets here in my life time,
> > hay take me to the stars. But right now we can safely send as I stated,
> > unmanned probes out into space, and still learn a whole heck of a lot.
>
> We won't go from where we are now to warp drive without a whole lot of
> incremental steps.
> The research into different propulsion systems to make getting to Mars
> easier would help get us there.
>
> >
> > But secondly let address your point about "human drive". Let me ask
> > you, don't think our "drive" has also come at a bit of a price because
> > we haven't stopped now and then to say "Gee, I wonder what will happen
> > one hundred years down the road if we do this...?" Global warming
> > anyone? But I agree that our "drive" is a large part of what makes us
> > human, but you know what else makes us human? Our ability to take
> > accountability for our actions and mistake (unlike animals) and to
> > *CARE FOR* and do something about the suffering of the impoverished.
>
> And we have done, are doing, and will continue to do something about the
> suffering of the impovrished.

Yep, because the problem is soooo getting better. I ask you, do you
really feel things are getting better?

>
> >
> > How can we with a clear conscience feel that we are advancing as humans
> > because we are reaching to the stars when men, women, and children die
> > every day simply because they don't have enough food?
>
> How  many do you think died of the same cause during the development of,
> say, the Internet?
>

A whole bloodly lot.

How does that in any possible context nullify what I said?
                                                                               
               
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