Text 18762, 188 rader
Skriven 2005-12-16 04:22:00 av FRANK SCHEIDT (1:123/140)
     Kommentar till en text av MICHIEL VAN DER VLIST
Ärende: WWII Immigration Stan
=============================
-=> Quoting Michiel Van Der Vlist to Frank Scheidt <=-

 MVDV>>> And I wouldn't be so quick to use the word parasite here. The US is
 MVDV>>> consuming 40% of the oil in the world. For 5% of the world's populatin
 MVDV>>> that is FAR more than a fair share. Who is the parasite here?
 >
 >> "Fair share"?  Who decides *that*?

 MVDV>> 20 kids at a birthday party. The fat boy takes half the cake,
 MVDV>> leaving the other half for the other 19 kids. You need a
 MVDV>> judge to decide if that is fair?
 
 > I'd say those 19 kids are rather stupid to put up with that.

 MVDV> Well, the fat boy has a gun.

You didn't say that.  After all, Al Capone (do you know who *he* 
was?) once was reputed to have said something like, "You can go 
farther with a kind word and a gun than with a kind word alone."  
BTW, those are not his exact words but close enough.

 MVDV> You are evading the question: do you need a judge to decide if that is
 MVDV> fair? 

To the fat kid it's eminently fair.

 > I know you're not using "fat kid" as an American analogy since
 > you'd have used "muscular, brainy kid" ...

 MVDV> Oh, but I *did* mean the it. Obesity is a serious problem in the USA.
 MVDV> "Brainy"? Sorry, the average American does not appear to be very
 MVDV> bright. 

Obesity *is* a serious problem here -- mainly because our economy 
is in such good shape that even the poorest among us can afford 
too much food.  As for the intelligence of the average American, 
well, it's *average*.

 >> The US produces more goods with that mere 40% of the oil than
 >> any other nation ...

 MVDV>> Really? Then where are those goods? It has been quit a while since I
 MVDV>> last saw something with "made in USA" on it.
 
 > We've gotten into the habit of marking "made in China" on our

 MVDV> Ha, good joke!
 
I kinda liked that myself ... heh heh heh ... actually, during 
the years prior to WWII Japanese products were often rejected in 
the US.  Then it came out that a lot of accepted products were 
marked as being manufactured in a Japanese city named "USA".  The 
designation "Made in USA" was stamped on them.

 > manufactured good to please the Asiatics ... check things out
 > ... *see* if you don't have a lot of goods with that "made in
 > China" label!

 MVDV> O, I do. But the manuals are a dead giveaway. Certainly not written by
 MVDV> a native (American) English speaker. ;-)

But, didn't you just say the average American isn't very bright?  
Why *wouldn't* he write in an ungrammatical way?

 MVDV>>> Neither does yours. Fact is that the world is NOT a safer
 MVDV>>> place then it was before this mad adventure in Iraq started.
 
 >> Yes it is!  The world is no-longer threatened with Saddam's
 >> reputed WMDs.

 MVDV>> They only existed in the imagination of GWB and his followers.
 MVDV>> The threat of WMD's was a fabrication.
 
 > *Now* you know what GWB *imagines*???  Wow!!

 MVDV> Elementary my dear Watson. There are no WMD's in Iraq. yet GWB said
 MVDV> they were there. So it must have been his imagination.
 
What if they *were* there, but were moved when Saddam realized 
Iraq was about to be invaded?  Have you considered that?  An 
objective person would at least *consider* that.  I'll bet *you* 
cannot even *consider* it as the remotest of possibilities!

 >> They have been moved.

 MVDV>> *If* they have been moved the threat is still there. Whoever has them
 MVDV>> must be a friend of Saddam and can still use them.
 
 > So?

 MVDV> You are contradicting yourself. First you said:
 
 >> The world is no-longer threatened with Saddam's reputed WMDs.

 MVDV> Now you say they have been moved. But ig they are only moved, the
 MVDV> threat they pose still exists.

Note the difference between "Saddam's" WMDs and the same WMDs 
*not* under his control.  They can be looked at in two entirely 
different ways, in effect as two different sets of items.  So 
since *Saddam's* WMDs don't exist they are no threat.  However 
what *were* his WMDs *are* a threat.

 MVDV>>> How about *your* fair share of contributing to a better
 MVDV>>> environment? You not only consume 40% of the world'soil,
 MVDV>>> you also contribute to the CO2 load by burning it.
 >
 >> As the saying goes, "you can't have an omelette without breaking eggs"

 MVDV>> One can refrain from making ommelets.
 
 > True ... so?

 MVDV> So stop making omelets.
 
Of course, since you've deleted the part to which the omelets 
referred I don't know what you're talking about.

 >> ... the overall effect of our oil-usage benefits the world.

 MVDV>> No, it benefits you.
 
 > We are part of the world, aren't we?

 MVDV> Yes but you are the only ones in the world that it benefits.

False!  Our production of goods and services helps the entire 
world.

 MVDV>>> I say *you* are the parasite.
 >
 >> I'll simply ignore the unwarranted insult and assume that's
 >> your way of covering up ... [sigh] ...

 MVDV>> So it is all right for you to call me a parasite, but that is a one
 MVDV>> way street?
 
 > I'm not calling you, personally, a parasite since I presume
 > you're justifying your life ... it's Europeans in general who
 > tend to be parasites, WRT their expectations of protection by
 > the U.S.

 MVDV> Then I say it is the Americans that are the parasite WRT the world's
 MVDV> resources. 

Not so, as we make good use of such resources.

 >>> Have it your way.  I hope you can live with that burden.
 >
 >> What burden?
 
 > The unfair burden of being a European ... one who hasn't yet
 > escaped to America ...

 MVDV> I do not perceive that as a burden. So I have no problem living with
 MVDV> it. 

You are one of a fortunate minority then, those few who would 
*not* emigrate here if they could, yet seem happy with their 
condition.  Surely the topic of some enterprising Psychology 
Ph.D. candidate.

 MVDV>> The burden of having to live with the knowledge that you
 MVDV>> are an accomplish in ruining this planet.
 
 > Fortunately the U.S. is *helping* this planet ...

 MVDV> They are helping themselves...
 
Yes, we live on this planet ...

 >> Your generation, OTOH, has largely benefitted from our many gifts.

 MVDV>> *your* gifts?

 MVDV>> Since when were radio and electric refrigeratiors *your* gifts?
 
 > Huh?  I had presumed you have moved *beyond* that ...

 MVDV> You should not presume so much.

Sorry ... I hadn't realized Europe was so primitive.

... "And now ... Number one ... The larch ... "; Monty Python

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