Text 37089, 121 rader
Skriven 2006-08-21 07:54:00 av FRANK SCHEIDT (1:123/140)
     Kommentar till en text av JEFF SMITH
Ärende: Frank - take a break (was
=================================
-=> Quoting Jeff Smith to Frank Scheidt <=-

 RC>>>>> Bush tells people how it is and the way its going to be.
 
 BF>>>> Of course I could argue with you about this but that would only
 BF>>>> make me look like the anti-American Shannon have made you all
 BF>>>> believe I am so I leave it.
 
 JS>>>      As far as he goes he does have a point. As a president Bush
 JS>>> is alot more decisive and willing to do what he thinks needs to
 JS>>> be done. Clinton on the other hand would say one thing but
 JS>>> faulter when it came time for actions instead of words. That is
 JS>>> not to say that I agree with a large part of the way Bush has
 JS>>> handled things though.
 
 BF>> Of course everyone have both good and bad sides but all we see
 BF>> and hear over here is how he exceeds his authorities like
 BF>> scanning all mail and email for Americans who communicates
 BF>> overseas although a judge have said that it's against the
 BF>> constitution. Still he wants to do it and will appeal against it
 BF>> because America is at war and the only war that's going on is in
 BF>> Iraq and that isn't even declared as a war.
 
 JS>> I think the gathering of intelligence is an important part of the
 JS>> war on terrorism. The problem is where to draw the line between
 JS>> fighting terrorism and invading people's privacy? I would not
 JS>> have a problem with scanning emails and cell calls for very
 JS>> specific keywords. But again the problem arises that you are
 JS>> trusting the intelligence community to stop at that point and to
 JS>> go no further. What the USA needs to do IMHO is to rebuild our
 JS>> human intelligence capabilities around the world. And rely less
 JS>> on technological intelligence.
 
 FS> This is a dangerous world in which we now live.  I think everyone
 FS> would agree with that.  GWB is probably doing what he considers
 FS> necessary to protect the nation.  The courts should make sure any
 FS> laws involved are constitutional.  Meanwhile we might as well
 FS> trust the president.

 JS> There are a number of things that I disagree with Bush about. But
 JS> I did vote for him as he was a better choice in my opinion than the
 JS> alternative would have been. I agree that the world today is alot more
 JS> complicated these days. Never had to worry about carrying liquids on a
 JS> plane before. <g> It's sad to see laws ignored or overlooked in the
 JS> fight on terrorism. If a law is enabled it should be applied to all
 JS> evenly. 

True enough.  Civil liberties are precious to me -- ever since 
*i* (and every *other* serviceman) lost them while serving during 
WWII.  They shouldn't be cast aside casually.  However, having 
said that, we *do* need strong laws which help defend this 
nation against terrorist fanatics.  The Supreme Court of the U.S. 
has the responsibility of determining the constitutionality of 
any "anti-terrorist" laws.
 
 JS>> There are many types of wars Björn. You say tomato I say tomahto.
 
 BF>>  If that isn't wanting to be a dictator I don't know what is and
 BF>> I don't understand how you all can accept it. And the judge that
 BF>> went against him is appointed by him so obviously he doesn't care
 BF>> what anyone eslse have to say.
 
 FS> Bjorn has a rather lengthy history here of being anti-American.
 FS> Hence his comments WRT America should be taken with the
 FS> traditional grain of salt ..

 JS> Now where might you have gotten that idea? <g>

Mostly by reading Bjorn's one-sided diatribes against America and 
Americans ... [sigh] ...
 
 JS>> I think "Dictator" is your choice of terms Björn. I think that
 JS>> Bush's goal is to eliminate terrorism. The question is to what
 JS>> extent is he willing to go? I agree that the war on terrorism
 JS>> needs to be fought and won. I differ with Bush in that I think
 JS>> that the biggest tools in the war on terrorism are communication
 JS>> and understanding of people. Where would Al Qaeda or Hezbollah be
 JS>> if they didn't have the blind support of people? The oher factor
 JS>> is the support that the terrorist groups are getting from other
 JS>> countries. Countries that are wanting to use the terrorist groups
 JS>> to further their own political and/or monitary goals.
 
 BF>> If Bush gets his will through, will that be the end for Fido for
 BF>> you since here we're rather anti-Bush? Or will you that doesn't
 BF>> agree with him 100% end up on a black-list? And what about the
 BF>> right to free speech? Has he really been thinking this through
 BF>> and have you?
 
 FS> We have free speech in America.  Much more even than in many
 FS> places in Europe, e.g., in England.

 JS> Yes we do. And sadly many use that very freedom to attack with.
 
True.  Unfortunately since we *do* have free speech we must be 
willing to listen to all shades of truth -- even the half-truths 
of an anti-American such as Bjorn.
 
 JS>> You are free to like or dislike who or what you choose. All that
 JS>> I ask is that people be fair in the expression of their views or
 JS>> opinions. To look at the whole picture instead of only part of
 JS>> it. And no, I am not suggesting that you are not here.
 
 FS> I have long asked people here to read what I've said about the
 FS> nuking of Hiroshima in 1945.  Few will read it objectively.

 JS> I was also glad to read your post on "Celebration" too. So much
 JS> was said about what others supposedly really meant. I was glad to hear
 JS> the words from the horses mouth. I have nevered cared to form opinions
 JS> or judgements on heresay. That is why I didn't respond to you until I
 JS> actually read your initial post.
 
Too many people simply will *not* read what I said, objectively.  
They have poorly-reasoned opinions regarding the bombings which 
ended the killing in WWII, and jump to totally unwarranted 
conclusions WRT my writing on the nuking of Hiroshima.

... Death is life's answer to the question 'Why?'

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