Text 44375, 133 rader
Skriven 2006-12-21 11:12:43 av Roy Witt (1:397/22)
  Kommentar till text 44208 av Michiel van der Vlist (2:280/5555)
Ärende: Insults
===============
19 Dec 06 23:38, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Roy Witt:

 MvdV> Hello Roy!

 MvdV> On Tuesday December 19 2006 13:43, you wrote to me:

 RW>>>> I can't speak for her, but I'd bet that she could do just as
 RW>>>> well at it as the cleaning lady, if she had to.

 MvdV>>> I am sure she could, but that isn't the point. Point is that
 MvdV>>> she does not have to.

 RW>> because there is work in her field, otherwise, she might have to.

 MvdV> Bottom line: she does not have to.

No, that's a variable. Bottom line is, she may or may not have to.

 MvdV>>>>> No, it was not a master/servant relationship and there was no
 MvdV>>>>> payment as it was an equal status relationship. We took turns
 MvdV>>>>> at doing the chores.

 RW>>>> Was she employed outside of your home?

 MvdV>>> On a part time basis, yes.

 RW>> the rest of the time, she was at home doing the cleaning.

 MvdV> Of course not. Not all the time. Ever so often she was acting net
 MvdV> control on the local 2m net while I did the cleaning.

LOL! We call that 'pussy whipped' where I come from.

 MvdV> She was good at that: running the net. She had a very clear voice
 MvdV> and of course being an xyl she never needed the linear. The second
 MvdV> X chromosome is good for two S points...

So is a voice processor.

 MvdV>>>>> And it is the same with my present compagnion of life. We
 MvdV>>>>> take an equal share in doing the dirty work.

 RW>>>> Can't afford a cleaning lady, eh...

 MvdV>>> It is not a matter of not being able to afford it.

 RW>> I know, taxes are so high in your country, one can't afford to buy
 RW>> bread, let alone hire a house-worker.

 MvdV> I have no problem buying bread. And if I can no longer but bread, I
 MvdV> can always buy cake.

As in Marie Antoinette.

 MvdV>>> As far as the economics are concerned, doing it myself is more
 MvdV>>> a matter of economic efficiency. You see when someone is
 MvdV>>> legally employed here roughly 50% of the money involved goes
 MvdV>>> into overhead.

 RW>> Here, there's a reason why most of them are self-employed in their
 RW>> own business. You see, a cleaning lady may be licensed as a business
 RW>> and there's no taxes paid by those who employ her services.

 MvdV> I see no reason why a cleaner could not operate as a bussiness
 MvdV> here, but I see no advantage either. It just raises the
 MvdV> adminstrative overhead.

The reason would be that the customer doesn't have to pay the taxes, thus
the possibility of you hiring a cleaning lady would be higher.

 RW>> She pays her own taxes and her customers have a legal tax deduction
 RW>> for services rendered.

 MvdV> In the end it makes no difference *who* actually pays the taxes. If
 MvdV> the cleaner ends up with 10 Euro in his/her hand after taxes, 20
 MvdV> Euro has to be footed by whoever employs him/her. The employer can
 MvdV> give the cleaner Eur 10 and pay Eur 10 in taxes, or the employer
 MvdV> can hand over Eur 20 to the cleaner and than the cleaner pays Eur
 MvdV> 10 on taxes. Same end result.

Unless the cleaning lady was a bonefide and licensed business, in which
case, the customer wouldn't have to pay any taxes.

 MvdV> Running the cleaning operation as a bussines does not help. Before
 MvdV> the cleaner can buy bread to eat, he/she has to transfer the money
 MvdV> form the bussines to his/her private wallet and then he/she pays
 MvdV> income tax. 50%. Same end result.

But then, you're overlooking the satisfaction of being self-employed. And
there must be some compensation in that when it comes time to file an
income report. i. e. business deductions.

 MvdV>  If the bussines buys the bread and gives it to the cleaner to eat,
 MvdV> it is considered income "in natura" and it is levied with income
 MvdV> tax. TANSTAAFL.

But does that stop the self-employed from being paid a wage by their own
business?

 MvdV>>> It is much more economical to just do the job myself. Then
 MvdV>>> noting gets lost in overhead.

 RW>> If you hire a contractor to build you a room addition (never mind
 RW>> that you don't have any room to spare for it), are you paying his
 RW>> taxes or are you 'employing' his services through his business?

 MvdV> I employ his services through his bussiness. He pays the taxes. And
 MvdV> of course his rates take that into account...

As would the cleaning ladies business.

 MvdV>>> Under our system, it seldom pays for a private individual to
 MvdV>>> hire someone to do a job for him/her. So most people only do
 MvdV>>> that when they are unable to do it themselves because it
 MvdV>>> requires special skills or special equipment. Cleaning does not
 MvdV>>> fall into that category.

 RW>> It does if I didn't own a vacuum cleaner and a mop.

 MvdV> The required equipment is widely available and the investment is
 MvdV> less than one hour's pays for the cleaner. If you can not afford a
 MvdV> vacuum cleaner, you surely can not afford to hire a cleaning lady.

And then of course, one must have the incentive and the ability to use the
equipment.

               R\%/itt




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