Text 9879, 203 rader
Skriven 2005-04-13 19:24:52 av Carol Shenkenberger (6:757/1)
   Kommentar till text 9875 av Roy Witt (1:10/22)
Ärende: Re: NIMBY
=================
*** Quoting Roy Witt from a message to Carol Shenkenberger ***

 CS> tracking the rich older son, not the poorer relations I came from.
 CS> Lots of money in the family, just not my side of it :-(

RW> That's how it is with Nancy's maternal grandparents' family. They own
RW> Texas oil wells and are rolling in money, but her side of the family
RW> doesn't get to share in it, unless they're visiting one of them.

*sigh* yup.  Enough filtered down that Mom was able to raise 3 kids and almost
never worked until later when we'd moved on and then, so she has social
security credits.  Nothing left for us kids though except a Mom who was home
for us and gave us joy to recall, so I call that a good deal.


RW> It would have been nice to be born a rich kid...

It was strange.  I didnt have money as a kid at all, but was raised in a rich
ethic and all that.  I know what spoon to use when presented with 4 at a
setting.  Forks are easier as you generally use the outer side layer first ;-)

 CS>> Lisa Anne Running-tree which doesnt sound very Cherokee at all,
 CS>> nor do I know what a 'Running-tree' is....

 RW>> Maybe she was a logger and her job was running on the tree (log)
 RW>> while it floated in the lake or river. That's what herding trees
 RW>> down stream is called; Running Trees.

 CS> Doubt it was her doing that ;-)  Maybe her family did something
 CS> like that? But I dont know that Indians did much 'logging' per-see.

RW> Probably not, but they could have worked for logging companys. She cou
RW> have been the daughter of one who did.

Dunno.  Mom was born in 1930.  Her Dad in 1885.  Lissa Anne was his grandmother
and may have been 1800 though probably 1820 or 1830.  The letters talking
about her are 1845 if I remember it right.


RW> My grandmother didn't like to claim her indian heritage, but my
RW> grandfather exploited it to the hilt. He liked to go fishing on the
RW> reservation because he didn't need a license and access was free. Then
RW> the indians got smart and started to charge $1 to park and $1 to fish
RW> from their shores. A boat in the water cost another buck. That was the
RW> day that gramps backed the 41 Chevy out of there and said he'd never g
RW> back. Don't know that he ever did, but he was stubborn enough to keep
RW> that promise.

heheheh. I dont think anyone in my family tried to claim any fishing rights
over this.

 CS> Island, german.  Family name was Von Papen, but they 'Americanized'
 CS> to Pape to avoid association with an infamous uncle who was high
 CS> with the Kaiser (and later not so high but was with Hitler).  Pape
 CS> is a very common name, like 'Smith' or 'Jones' but in Germany along
 CS> the French border.

 CS> There's even a region called the Pape region I think.  They make
 CS> red wine too.  Chateau du Pape.

RW> Southern France. They make both red and white wine there.

I've never heard of the white wine, but the red is exported.  I even bought a
bottle once just to experience it but well, red wine isnt my thing so I didnt
enjoy it as much as it probably was worth.

 CS> war) and by the Civil war, we spanned the border and there are some
 CS> very sad (and true) tales about brothers literally being split on
 CS> it.

RW> Yeup. My GG-grandfather fought for the yankees and his younger brother
RW> joined the SC rebels, never to be heard from again. Although a couple
RW> my relatives who delve into these things have claimed that they've fou
RW> part of his trail.

Same here.  Much of the 'money trail' for my branch peters out then, the rest
in the 1929 crash although they had enough left for world trotting, just not
enough to last down to my generation.  Lasted well through Mom as a child
however.


RW> Where they per chance, ran into the Witts, Rochkas, Winchesters, Scott
RW> Dahms, Clarks, etc...

Possibly!  Actually, there is a reference to a Scott and a Winchester, though
I'm not the historian my Mom is.  Look for relations to:  Schyler, Corbet
(Corbett), McGuire, Phillips.  Schyler is phonetically 'Sky Ler' and has
alternative spellings like Corbet has.  McGuire is also MacGuire (old scotts
name, MyGyire and MyGwre as well? Border area name along the welsh border
lands).

 CS> bit more mixed than yours may be, but then I do not know.

RW> I'd say a genetic mix of Heinz 57 varieties.

LOL!  Like most of us!  

 CS> Heheh but probably some good tales!

RW> Things I didn't know and memories that I didn't even remember about my
RW> own youth. He remembered places where he lived as a kid. I can't recal
RW> anything that far back in my own past.

I recall pretty well.  My middle name is Elise (E-leese) and so after an aunt I
met once before she died.  She was on my Dads side and since Mom split from
Dad when I was 2, not much contact with that side of the family.  Mom took us
on a trip though once up there and i met her.  Lovely woman i am proud to be
related to.  Had i been lucky enough to have a passel of kids, I'd have an
Elise Shenkenberger just for her gentle memory that I have of her as a child. 
A grand-dam who would kneel in the dirt with a kid and explain a blueberry
seedling.  I must have been 6 when i met her the only time.


RW> Nothing as exciting in my family's past, but Nancy's boasts of a horse
RW> thief who shot his wife and her lover in his bed (the horse thief's),
RW> before they caught up with him. New Mexico territory turn of the 20th
RW> century.

OHH!! COOL!  We got some darker elves in ours as well.  Told ya about the Doc
with 2 wives in the same town but there was the Schyler fellow, who reputedly
came over on a galows ship but talked so smooth they let him go on the
stateside.  Something about 'murder most foule' over a girl?  Or of the girl?

He either killed over a 12 year old girl, or killed a 12 year old girl.  It's
not clear.  Dont tell Schyler VA residents of that though.  They dont have the
records and he's an Icon there <g>.


 CS>> Neither were politically correct for WASP type USA folks to claim,
 CS>> so ....

 RW>> Things like that are left out of family histories, even today. A
 RW>> broth marries an ex-wife and the kids from the previous marriage
 RW>> have the sa sur-name as the ones from the present marriage, yet
 RW>> they're brother an sister only by their mother's bloodline.

 CS> Yeah doesnt help that they liked the same common names so:
 CS> Charlotte Elizabeth travels through time to be grandmother and
 CS> daughter and grand-daughter ;)

RW> As do variations of my grandmother's name of Elizabeth, only it became
RW> generic when they called my sister by GM Elizabeth's nickname, Becky.
RW> I just happen to be from a long line of Roy's, but I was adamant that
RW> didn't get passed on to my son. Which started a new string where each
RW> kid has the intials of MW ... I used to call them Monkey Wards...

Heheh I chose to continue the tradition.  It would have been Elizabeth if I'd
been named Charlotte.  I'd have been harder put for a boy name, except Don and
I both agreed having a kid with the same name as the parent, is not 'good' nor
is it 'good' to have the same name as 1/2 your classmates.  We were looking aw
Jerimiah when Charlotte popped out.

 RW>> she was abl to cook for and catch a rich farmer. 'course, being an
 RW>> Ichabod Crain (sp) type of guy, he wasn't a good looking prize
 RW>> himself.

 CS> Grin!  I like it!  Looks are sorta shy on my side of the family
 CS> too.

RW> The above always reminded me of that famous portrait with the farmer
RW> holding a pitch fork and his wife next to him. Mutt and Jeff, if you
RW> know what I mean. :o)

LOL!  Thats my family too.  We occasionally hit 'handsome'.


 CS> We are 'cute' not 'lovely'.  Most of us though, are good
 CS> cooks (Sister is the exception but her husband is a whiz with food
 CS> and wont let her even try). My Mom was a lovely woman (handsome
 CS> actually would be best term) but she's not a fancy cook.  Edible
 CS> food if you consider school lunches edible ;-) Wonderful in all
 CS> other ways though so I was blessed as a child.
 CS>                                        xxcarol

RW> Well, the looks department in this family came from my paternal
RW> grandmother. With the Indian and Scot blood, she was a looker. My dad
RW> and I are the benefactors of that blood line, while my siblings look
RW> more like my mother's side of the family. Typical bulldog Brits. The
RW> Witts, all looked like your typical German, big bones and all of the
RW> men were bald.

Big bones?  Sis got those from Dad.  I got the scaled down version but i happen
to like having square shoulders.  Thick (over thick) hair still at age 45 and
my brother is the same.


RW> Dad had all of his hair when he died and I still have all of mine. Dad
RW> was truely blonde w/blue eyes, while my eyes are also blue and my
RW> hair is/was dishwater blond and turned to brown later in life.

I was a redhead (mixed with brown/gold) as a kid but it has darkened to at
most, 'auburn' now.  Funny how that hit around age 25-30 and got darker.... I
actually look more 'natural' when I color it back to what I had as a kid.

I do however have this really nifty grey spray from the widows peake that looks
pretty good. I'm a bit early for that much grey but the indian ancestry brings
that in I think.  I see people try to dye in a look like that, but the natural
thing cant be faked.

                                       xxcarol

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