Text 34089, 166 rader
Skriven 2009-07-02 11:16:49 av Roy Witt (1:397/22)
  Kommentar till text 34052 av Robert Bashe (2:2448/44)
Ärende: Guns and Banks
======================
02 Jul 09 11:12, Robert Bashe wrote to Roy Witt:

 RB> Roy Witt wrote to Robert Bashe on Wednesday July 01 2009 at 12:48:

 RB>>> Roy, I hate to interrupt such a good story, but there are
 RB>>> definitely NO "sky marshalls" on German flights. The idea was
 RB>>> soundly rejected by parliament when it was proposed. And the
 RB>>> pilots are NOT armed - the pilot's assciation refused that.

 RW>> Yeah, sure.

 RW>> "U.S. officials said Germany law enforcement is providing full
 RW>> coverage of flights by Lufthansa and other German-based carriers
 RW>> flying into the United States. "They are stretched so thin they've
 RW>> had to rely on German military officers to help out," one U.S.
 RW>> official said."

 RB> Mind telling me how that quote translates to the use of "sky
 RB> marshalls"?

That's a direct quote from an article that makes the case that your claim
is as false as they come. Sky marshalls are on Lufthansa in spite of what
you claim!

 RB> Roy, I KNOW this is not true.

You only think you know.

 RB> And if the government were lying to the population about this, the
 RB> truth would come out the first time any incident occurred and the
 RB> government would be caught red-handed not only in a lie, but in a
 RB> violation of the constitution. Forget it.

Google this: U.S. Air Marshals Flooding German, British Flights

If you're lucky, you can read the entire article yourself. And it isnt'
dated 2001.

 RW>>>> The pilot does what their employer says they do, or they don't
 RW>>>> fly company airplanes for a living. Just because the pilot is
 RW>>>> the captain of his ship, that doesn't mean he's sitting on a
 RW>>>> thrown.

 RB>>> But it _does_ mean that he has the final say on the aircraft.

 RW>> Like I said, within the guidelines of their employer. If they say
 RW>> 'air marshalls' shall fly on your airplane, they will fly on your
 RW>> airplane.

 RB> If the aircraft is American they will. Otherwise, it depends on the
 RB> laws in the country where the aircraft is registered.

If a foriegn airline agrees to allow air marshalls, they'll have the
definition in their company policy. However, not all air marshalls on
Europeon aircraft are Americans, they could be German military officers.

 RB>>> Do what he says or leave. The employer can replace him, of
 RB>>> course, but except in a very critical case (drunk pilot) will
 RB>>> not.

 RW>> First of all, he cannot refuse an air marshall even if he wanted to.

 RB> You're digging your heels in under the assumption that American laws
 RB> apply throughout the world.

No, I'm just stating what happens when someone agrees to have air
marshalls on board. They're not necessarily American air marshalls.

 RB> They don't, and things will stay that way
 RB> even if you claim otherwise until hell freezes over.

 RW>> And to make Dossche's story even less believable, air marshalls
 RW>> don't fly solo...see next...

 RB> [quote from Ward]

[quote from Ward rejected out of hand]

 RB> You're grasping at straws, Roy, and again making assumptions.

I'm making no assumptions, this is from factual documents that you refuse
to find out for yourself.

 RW>>>> As federal officers (government officer<>federal agent) they're
 RW>>>> exempt from such local BS...

 RB>>> The old crap about Americans being above the law, eh, Roy?

 RW>> Reading comprehensin, Bob. How do you figure El Al gets away with
 RW>> armed air marshalls? Israeli' have agreements with governments that
 RW>> allow for them to be there legally.

 RB> As Ward wrote, they don't leave the plane,

Ward is attempting to justify El Al air marshalls, because he previously
stated that air marshalls would be arrested when their feet touched Belgum
soil. He's full of shit.

 RB> and Israeli law permits them to carry weapons on Israeli planes.

And have been for over 30 years. Long before it was known to the peons
where they land.

 RB> The minute they step outside the plane, they have no right to have
 RB> weapons.

Your source of information stating this parnoia.

 RB> And they also have no right to carry weapons on flights of other
 RB> (foreign) carriers with a destination in Israel - unless the
 RB> Americans have an arrangement with the Israelis to permit that on
 RB> American carriers. And that would only apply to American carriers and
 RB> nothing else.

It's no wonder you dont' want to leave Germany. YOu don't have a clue how
international agreements work, let alone who air marshalls are.

 RB>>>  And their "federal status" in the States is worth zilch except
 RB>>> in the USA.

 RW>> Wrong. See above.

 RB> Right. Outside the USA, American laws do NOT!!! apply.

Wrong again. If Germany has an agreement allowing air marshalls on board
their airlines with a destination of the US, they don't have to be
American air marshalls.

 RB>>> But that kind of attitude is apparently not rare in the States

 RW>> I was thinking the same thing about the arrogance of the Euro
 RW>> plebesites who think they know everything.

 RB> And all the time you know that _you_ have that distinction... ;-)

Not me...it's just a reflection on your ignorance that makes you think so.

 RB> Incidentally, you should learn the difference between a "pebiscite"
 RB> and a "pleb". The first one is an election.

Your total lack of an education is showing again.

The etymology of the word is from the Latin 'plebis scitum' law voted by
the comitia, literally, decree of the common people.

Take a look in the mirror and tell me that you're not of the common people
and have blue blood running in your veins.

 RB>>> I can still remember the case of a guy being "arrested" (kidnapped)
 RB>>> by American agents in Italy - that caused quite a diplomatic flap,
 RB>>> and the Italians weren't a bit "amused".

 RW>> Kinda like the arrest of Menno Blom...

 RB> Not quite, unless Blom was arrested by Dutch police on American soil.

The arrest of Blom caused quite a stir among those who thought he was
'trapped' into a jail cell. Those people weren't 'amused' either.

                R\%/itt

Joy lives in the fight, in the attempt, in the suffering involved, not in
the victory itself.

--- Twit(t) Filter v2.1 (C) 2000
 * Origin: SATX Alamo Area Net * South * Texas, USA * (1:397/22)