Text 34777, 144 rader
Skriven 2009-08-05 14:09:04 av Lee Lofaso (3:800/432.0)
  Kommentar till text 34741 av Michiel Van Der Vlist (2:280/5555)
Ärende: Question to Ponder
==========================
Hello Michiel,

>LL>A planetary body the size of Jupiter cannot support life as we know
>LL>it. A planetary body the size of Mercury cannot support life as we
>LL>know it. That much should be obvious, given the laws of physics.
MVDV>Oh? Mercury is too small that is for sure.

Mercury is too hot.

MVDV>But why exclude Jupiter?

Jupiter is too cold.

MVDV>The gravity on the surface is only about 2.5 times
MVDV>that of earth. It would exclude elephants and Rhino, but a
MVDV>sheep sized animal would not be a problem.

I seriously doubt a human could stand up, much less sit down, on
the surface of the jovian giant.  But I have absolutely no doubt he
or she would become an instant popsicle.

MVDV>Of course there is no breathable oxygen and it is too cold,
MVDV>but that is another story.

Man can survive the deepest cold in Antarctica.  So why not
the deepest cold in space?  Man can survive the deepest ocean
in the world, where even fish cannot breathe through gills.
So why not the airless vacuum in space?

>LL>But a plantetary body does not have to be exactly the same size or
>LL>mass as that of the Earth to support life as we know it.

MVDV>"Exactly" was not the word that I used.

What are the parameters of a planet to be able to support life as
we know it?  Can we even guess?

>LL>That too should be obvious.  How much leeway would there be? Probably
>LL>more than you think.
MVDV>The leeway that I spoke about was about the specific density,
MVDV>not the size.

We think of life as existing on Earth.  The only conception of
life on other planets we can comprehend is in comparison to our
own understanding of life as existing on Earth.  If you were to
use your own imagination in drawing or painting a picture of an
alien from another world, that alien would have characteristics
similar to what we find on Earth, whether human or otherwise.

How do we know what can exist on worlds other than Earth?  Is it
possible for us to know without experiencing firsthand what life
is like on that world?  There could be intelligent life we would
never recognize, such as beings the size of ants that have built
a civilization far superior to our own.  We simply have no way
of knowing or experiencing such things.

>LL>A planetary body the size of the Moon could support human life if
>LL>it had the right mass and atmosphere, etc.
>MVDV>So what density would the material that is was made off
>MVDV>have to be? Simple answer: about 6 times the density of the
>MVDV>green cheese our moon is made of. Go figure.
>LL>The Moon is a very light object in terms of mass and density.
>LL>A planetary object of the same size but 6 times the density would
>LL>still be far too light in terms of mass and density to support
>LL>life as we know it.  Even if that object is made of green cheese.
MVDV>Gravity on the surface of the moon is 1/6 of that pf earth.
MVDV>If the density is siz times as gigh, the gravity on the
MVDV>surface would be 1 G. Excellent for supporting life.

But what kind of life?  That is the question.

MVDV>However.. The mass of the moon is 7.3 x 10^22kg. Its
MVDV>diameter is 2475 km. So its volume is 2.3 x 10^22 liters. --
MVDV>specific density just over 3.

So far so good...

MVDV>To get a 6 times higher density it would have to be made of
MVDV>tungsten, uranium, plutonium or platinum.

Okay.  Here's the skinny.  The outside surface of the Moon is
dirt and rocks, about five miles thick.  More like artificial dirt
and rocks, kind of like broken up concrete.  Underneath that dirt
and rocks is a layer of hardened metals, a mixture of metals, about
twenty miles thick.  IOW, an alloy of metals, artificially made,
making the Moon a worldlet rather than a natural satellite.
Inside that sphere is a heavy duty motor, along with a fuel tank.
But the Moon ran out of fuel long ago, which is why it remains
stranded in Earth orbit.

>LL>We would more likely send prisoners to Mars, allowing them to
>LL>build new cities there, thus freeing up Earth of all troublemakers.

MVDV>That would violate the declaration of human rights: no
MVDV>extremely hars punishment.

Once on Mars they would be Martians and no longer human.

>LL>Earth, once known as Tiamat, has been successfully terraformed.
>LL>Those who terraformed the Earth have since left, some 12,600 years
>LL>ago, according to Erich Von Daniken.

MVDV>Yeah right...

I might have gotten Erich Von Daniken confused with Zecharia Sitchin.
Von Daniken said our visitors from space left Earth some 12,600 years
ago and have yet to return, basing his theory on his expeditions around
the world.  Sitchin said our visitors from space came to Earth some
450,000 years ago, left sometime around when Moses led his people out
of Egypt, but will return at the end of days (possibly December 21,
2012), basing most of his theory on legends of ancient Sumeria.

>MVDV>There is no oxygen on Mars. No way that humans can adapt to
>MVDV>live on Mars as it is. But maybe an artificial environment
>MVDV>can be created on Mars that will support human life.
>LL>There is oxygen on Mars, most of it embedded in the soil.
>LL>Terraforming the planet, or creating an environment on Mars that man
>LL>can survive in, will take a lot a planning, and time, way beyond both
>LL>your lifetime and mine.
MVDV>But that wasn't  your original question. That was "how big
MVDV>must a planet be for one man to live on."

Or words to that effect.

MVDV>Obviously one man can not live without life support on Mars as it is.

Mars can be terraformed.

>MVDV>Frankly I don't see much future in a colony on Mars. It will be a
>MVDV>drop in the ocean regarding the overpopulation problem.
>LL>Toutatis will solve the overpopulation problem.
>LL>And if not Toutatis, then some other asteroid.
MVDV>Oh well...

There are also a myriad of other ways in which all life on this planet
could come to an end...

--Lee


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