Text 1822, 144 rader
Skriven 2009-12-19 07:59:24 av Lee Lofaso (3:800/432.0)
   Kommentar till text 1803 av Robert Bashe (2:2448/44)
Ärende: Ivan the Terrible
=========================
Hello Bob,

>LL>Eichmann never harmed a fly.

>RB>A very ignorant statement, Lee.

>LL>Not at all.  Eichmann was a clerk.  Just a lowly clerk.

RB>Lowly clerks weren't invited to the Wannsee Conference,
RB>and didn't prepare the minutes at the personal request of
RB>Reinhard Heydrich.

Preparing the minutes of a meeting is hardly what anybody would
call an act of genocide, much less murder.

>RB>Ever hear of the "Wannsee Conference"? Eichmann was present, and
>RB>wrote the minutes and arranged for the deportation of jews ("units")
>RB>to the extermination camps.

>LL>Work camps, Bob. Work camps.

RB>Are you drunk, Lee, or on some other drug? That's the only
RB>explanation I can think of for such utterly stupid remarks
RB>unless I consider you a total idiot, which I don't like to
RB>do with anyone who can write in this echo.

Utterly stupid?  Germans are not stupid people.  They believed in
Hitler as their savior.  So did Austrians and other Germanic peoples.
To them, Hitler saved their country from economic ruin, as well as
their culture.  To them, Hitler protected Germany from invasion by
hostile countries.  Germans fought valiantly for their Fatherland,
up until the very end.

"Why did you bomb our cities?"
"Why did you bomb our schools?"
"What have Germans done to deserve such a fate?"

When Hitler took power (he did so through legal means) we laughed
and made jokes about him.  Later, we demonized him.  Just as we
demonized others (such as Saddam Hussein).  However, the reality is
that Hitler was just a politician.  Not a monster.  Except one of
our own creation.

All democracies have fascist tendencies.  Nazi Germany was no
exception.  Even the USA has fallen into that trap.  Look at the
policies of FDR in regards to internment camps for Japanese and
Japanese Americans.  Look at the policies of GWB in regards to
rounding up Arabs and those of Arab descent after the events
of 9-11.  Yes, such things can, and did, happen here.

The Nazis are accused of having set up death camps.  Historians
have found much documentation, verifying those camps as not being
a fairy tale.

The Nazis placed signs in front of those camps, most notably Auschwitz,
proclaiming "Arbeit Macht Frei". The English translation would be "Work
Sets You Free".  Who put the sign up on the main entrance to Auschwitz?
Polish workers.  Employed by the Nazis.  Several other camps had a sign
on their entrance with those very same words.

The other night, thieves stole the sign at Auschwitz.  The thieves
scampered away, with the sign, in the snow, and remain at large.  The
sign is nowhere to be found.  Despite video surveillance, no video
footage was captured of the theft.

What kind of sickos would have stolen the sign?  Why would anybody
want to do such a thing?  Nazi memorablia is very valuable.  And some
collectors are willing to pay a very handsome sum for such an item.

The fact of the matter is that Nazis did refer to those places of
death as "work camps".  Most Germans before and during WWII had
absolutely no idea those places existed, or that their government
would be so cruel as to systematically seek to exterminate an
entire people.  Not even FDR believed such a thing, until Albert
Einstein and others showed him absolute proof.

RB>Or are you merely a rabid antisemite? If so, that hasn't
RB>been apparent up to now.

Anti-Semitism is hostility towards Jews (not Semites).  This
can be on an individual level, but can also take on the form of
institutional prejudice and persecution.  Adolf Hitler's ideology
of National Socialism was an extreme form, of which there is much
historical documentation.

Adolf Hitler was a politician.  His philosophy of National Socialism
was a philosophy of hate.  In order for that philosophy to succeed,
Hitler needed a scapegoat.  The most convenient scapegoats for Hitler
were Jews and Communists.  Without a scapegoat(s), Hitler never would
have been able to gain or hold onto power in Germany.  In that sense,
Jews and Communists were his best friends.

Another example of individual anti-Semitism would be David Duke, former
grand wizard of the Ku Klux Klan.  As a student at LSU (Duke majored in
history, but never graduated), he put on full Nazi garb, and gave a
public speech on the steps of the LSU Student Union ("Free Speech Alley"
has been a tradition at LSU for decades).  I was there, and listened to
his rant. The guy is, as he was then, a white supremist.  Not only does
he hate blacks, but he also hates other groups, such as gays, lesbians,
Catholics, retarded, disabled, and non-whites.  But he most especially
hates Jews. To him, Jews are even lower than blacks. Duke is an
excellent speaker, and knows exactly how far he can go without actually
crossing the line.  But when he gave that speech at LSU, some of the
students wanted to lynch him.  Literally. Fortunately, the black
students kept those white students from doing such a dastardly thing.

Needless to say, the Ku Klux Klan (as an organization) is extremely
anti-Semitic.  Not just racist.  In fact, David Duke recently traveled
to Iran, meeting with the madcap president of that country in order
to deny the Shoah ever existed.  Talk about two peas in a pod.

Sometimes people confuse criticism of Israel with anti-Semitism.
It is not anti-Semitic to criticize the actions of Israel any more
than it would be anti-(fill-in-the-blank) to criticize the actions
of any other nation.

Facts: Israel has never adhered to the territorial boundaries set
by U.N. Resolution 181, refuses to join the IAEA, has not signed the
nuclear non-proliferation treay, does not allow inspections of their
nuclear facilities, continues to engage in apartheid polices towards
its Arab citizens and Palestinians, continues to construct illegal
settlements in occupied Palestinian territories, refuses to cooperate
with the U.N. Human Rights Commission investigating war crimes in
Gaza, and has summarily dismissed the Goldstone report dealing with
war crimes in Gaza during the "Cast Lead" operation.

These are facts, not anti-Semitism.

"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is that good men do nothing."
- Edmund Burke

Was Edmund Burke anti-Semitic?  I don't think so.  Burke's
statement holds true when it comes to each and every country
in the world (and its refusal to accept responsibility for
its actions).  Why should Israel be exempt?  Why should any
country be exempt?  Burke's statement applies to ALL!

--Lee


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