Tillbaka till svenska Fidonet
English   Information   Debug  
ENET.SOFT   0/11701
ENET.SYSOP   33903
ENET.TALKS   0/32
ENGLISH_TUTOR   0/2000
EVOLUTION   0/1335
FDECHO   0/217
FDN_ANNOUNCE   0/7068
FIDONEWS   24126
FIDONEWS_OLD1   0/49742
FIDONEWS_OLD2   0/35949
FIDONEWS_OLD3   0/30874
FIDONEWS_OLD4   0/37224
FIDO_SYSOP   12852
FIDO_UTIL   0/180
FILEFIND   0/209
FILEGATE   0/212
FILM   0/18
FNEWS_PUBLISH   4408
FN_SYSOP   41678
FN_SYSOP_OLD1   71952
FTP_FIDO   0/2
FTSC_PUBLIC   0/13599
FUNNY   0/4886
GENEALOGY.EUR   0/71
GET_INFO   105
GOLDED   0/408
HAM   0/16070
HOLYSMOKE   0/6791
HOT_SITES   0/1
HTMLEDIT   0/71
HUB203   466
HUB_100   264
HUB_400   39
HUMOR   0/29
IC   0/2851
INTERNET   0/424
INTERUSER   0/3
IP_CONNECT   719
JAMNNTPD   0/233
JAMTLAND   0/47
KATTY_KORNER   0/41
LAN   0/16
LINUX-USER   0/19
LINUXHELP   0/1155
LINUX   0/22092
LINUX_BBS   0/957
mail   18.68
mail_fore_ok   249
MENSA   0/341
MODERATOR   0/102
MONTE   0/992
MOSCOW_OKLAHOMA   0/1245
MUFFIN   0/783
MUSIC   0/321
N203_STAT   926
N203_SYSCHAT   313
NET203   321
NET204   69
NET_DEV   0/10
NORD.ADMIN   0/101
NORD.CHAT   0/2572
NORD.FIDONET   189
NORD.HARDWARE   0/28
NORD.KULTUR   0/114
NORD.PROG   0/32
NORD.SOFTWARE   0/88
NORD.TEKNIK   0/58
NORD   0/453
OCCULT_CHAT   0/93
OS2BBS   0/787
OS2DOSBBS   0/580
OS2HW   0/42
OS2INET   0/37
OS2LAN   0/134
OS2PROG   0/36
OS2REXX   0/113
OS2USER-L   207
OS2   0/4786
OSDEBATE   0/18996
PASCAL   0/490
PERL   0/457
PHP   0/45
POINTS   0/405
POLITICS   0/29554
POL_INC   0/14731
PSION   103
R20_ADMIN   1121
R20_AMATORRADIO   0/2
R20_BEST_OF_FIDONET   13
R20_CHAT   0/893
R20_DEPP   0/3
R20_DEV   399
R20_ECHO2   1379
R20_ECHOPRES   0/35
R20_ESTAT   0/719
R20_FIDONETPROG...
...RAM.MYPOINT
  0/2
R20_FIDONETPROGRAM   0/22
R20_FIDONET   0/248
R20_FILEFIND   0/24
R20_FILEFOUND   0/22
R20_HIFI   0/3
R20_INFO2   3218
R20_INTERNET   0/12940
R20_INTRESSE   0/60
R20_INTR_KOM   0/99
R20_KANDIDAT.CHAT   42
R20_KANDIDAT   28
R20_KOM_DEV   112
R20_KONTROLL   0/13270
R20_KORSET   0/18
R20_LOKALTRAFIK   0/24
R20_MODERATOR   0/1852
R20_NC   76
R20_NET200   245
R20_NETWORK.OTH...
...ERNETS
  0/13
R20_OPERATIVSYS...
...TEM.LINUX
  0/44
R20_PROGRAMVAROR   0/1
R20_REC2NEC   534
R20_SFOSM   0/340
R20_SF   0/108
R20_SPRAK.ENGLISH   0/1
R20_SQUISH   107
R20_TEST   2
R20_WORST_OF_FIDONET   12
RAR   0/9
RA_MULTI   106
RA_UTIL   0/162
REGCON.EUR   0/2056
REGCON   0/13
SCIENCE   0/1206
SF   0/239
SHAREWARE_SUPPORT   0/5146
SHAREWRE   0/14
SIMPSONS   0/169
STATS_OLD1   0/2539.065
STATS_OLD2   0/2530
STATS_OLD3   0/2395.095
STATS_OLD4   0/1692.25
SURVIVOR   0/495
SYSOPS_CORNER   0/3
SYSOP   0/84
TAGLINES   0/112
TEAMOS2   0/4530
TECH   0/2617
TEST.444   0/105
TRAPDOOR   0/19
TREK   0/755
TUB   0/290
UFO   0/40
UNIX   0/1316
USA_EURLINK   0/102
USR_MODEMS   0/1
VATICAN   0/2740
VIETNAM_VETS   0/14
VIRUS   0/378
VIRUS_INFO   0/201
VISUAL_BASIC   0/473
WHITEHOUSE   0/5187
WIN2000   0/101
WIN32   0/30
WIN95   0/4288
WIN95_OLD1   0/70272
WINDOWS   0/1517
WWB_SYSOP   0/419
WWB_TECH   0/810
ZCC-PUBLIC   0/1
ZEC   4

 
4DOS   0/134
ABORTION   0/7
ALASKA_CHAT   0/506
ALLFIX_FILE   0/1313
ALLFIX_FILE_OLD1   0/7997
ALT_DOS   0/152
AMATEUR_RADIO   0/1039
AMIGASALE   0/14
AMIGA   0/331
AMIGA_INT   0/1
AMIGA_PROG   0/20
AMIGA_SYSOP   0/26
ANIME   0/15
ARGUS   0/924
ASCII_ART   0/340
ASIAN_LINK   0/651
ASTRONOMY   0/417
AUDIO   0/92
AUTOMOBILE_RACING   0/105
BABYLON5   0/17862
BAG   135
BATPOWER   0/361
BBBS.ENGLISH   0/382
BBSLAW   0/109
BBS_ADS   0/5290
BBS_INTERNET   0/507
BIBLE   0/3563
BINKD   0/1119
BINKLEY   0/215
BLUEWAVE   0/2173
CABLE_MODEMS   0/25
CBM   0/46
CDRECORD   0/66
CDROM   0/20
CLASSIC_COMPUTER   0/378
COMICS   0/15
CONSPRCY   0/899
COOKING   32896
COOKING_OLD1   0/24719
COOKING_OLD2   0/40862
COOKING_OLD3   0/37489
COOKING_OLD4   0/35496
COOKING_OLD5   9370
C_ECHO   0/189
C_PLUSPLUS   0/31
DIRTY_DOZEN   0/201
DOORGAMES   0/2056
DOS_INTERNET   0/196
duplikat   6002
ECHOLIST   0/18295
EC_SUPPORT   0/318
ELECTRONICS   0/359
ELEKTRONIK.GER   1534
ENET.LINGUISTIC   0/13
ENET.POLITICS   0/4
Möte FIDONEWS_OLD3, 30874 texter
 lista första sista föregående nästa
Text 20381, 86 rader
Skriven 2011-07-02 10:42:48 av Robert Bashe (2:2448/44)
Ärende: Forget the nitpicking (was: What a day!)
================================================
Just to repeat an _important_ matter, in contrast to the nitpicking:


Well, the Greek parliament passed the emergency austerity measures of the
government, and for the present, the Euro (and the EU) has been saved. Only
time will tell what happens now.

The reactions are frightening, however.

The Greeks are furious, not only at their own politicians but mainly at the
Germans, who have never ceased to pat themselves on the back at their economic
recovery and berate the Greeks for "sponging", "being lazy", "taking too much
vacation" (this from Ms. Merkel, who hurriedly became silent after she was told
that Germans have more vacation than Greeks), and advising the Greeks  - as if
most of the latter didn't realize their difficult situation - how _they_ should
act. Naturally the Greeks, in their present situation, resent such attitudes
bitterly.

The Germans, on the other hand, are screaming about "handouts" to "deadbeat"
Greece and worried about having to pay even more to keep Greece afloat. Many
think the Greeks should leave the Euro zone (how? the treaties don't provide
for such an event)) and everthing will be just fine. Most also propose a return
to the DM. A recent poll indicated that around 70% of those asked would prefer
the DM to the Euro.

Few on either side consider the consequences of a Greek default, or - if even
possible - a withdrawal of Greece from the Euro zone. That, naturally, would
produce economic chaos not only in Greece, but in the entire EU and probably
throughout the world. In case of a withdrawal, the value new/old Greek
currency, the drachma, would drop through the floor and Greece would be forced
to default on all outstanding Euro-denominated bonds. That, in turn, would not
only kill any hope of Greece managing to borrow on international markets in the
forseeable future and drive both inflation and unemployment to record heights,
but it would also put many large banks in the EU - mainly in France and Germany
- into bankruptcy and they would have to be bailed out, costing additional
funds the respective governments simply don't have.

American banks, that have been leading the way in default swaps, would
similarly be in trouble, although nobody really knows how bad the situation
would be.

In the case of Germany, a return to the DM would be similarly disasterous,
since the exchange rate of the DM (to the dollar and whatever is left of the
euro) would then go sky high, effectively pricing German exporters out of
foreign markets and killing the mainstay of German prosperity - goods export. A
steep recession and large-scale unemployment would threaten.

Whatever the result, the economic crisis - coming so soon after the crisis of
2009 - would not do the world economy any good, and would doubtless financially
hurt quite a lot of people in quite a number of countries.

Most of the populations on both sides - Greek and German - are either resigned
to their fate or only interested in their own situation, as they see it and
ignoring the effects on trade and their economy that a collapse of the EU zone
would cause.

Nobody really has a good answer to the situation, and it seems to me the
politicians, for once, are thinking more clearly than their populations. But
some may be thinking better than others - Sarkozy's proposal for banks to
exchange short-term loans for longer-term ones when the former become due is at
least a positive idea, in contrast to most of what I've heard from Berlin up to
now. The main problem most proposals face is that any debt restructuring must
be _voluntary_ on the part of the creditors to avoid a declaration of Greek
default by the rating agencies, which in turn would trigger massive reactions,
not least by the ECB, which could then no longer accept Greek bonds as
collateral. An uncontrolled default of that type would be even worse than the
current situation.

Greece should never have entered the Euro zone, but that's water over the
bridge and it's there now, and what affects Greece affects the Euro and the EU.

The main thing now is to keep the Greek crisis from becoming a Euro-zone crisis
and then an EU crisis. I hope that will be possible, but the reactions of the
populations in Greece and Germany certainly don't give much reason for
optimism.

Cross your fingers and hope for the best - that's what I'm doing too.

Cheers, Bob

P.S. I've intentionally ignored the "domino effect" a Greek default could have
on other Euro-zone countries, since that is really speculation at this point.
But if Greece goes down, it won't be the only Euro-zone country to do so.

--- GoldED+/W32 1.1.5-0613
 * Origin: Jabberwocky System - 02363-56073 ISDN/V34 (2:2448/44)