Text 21393, 131 rader
Skriven 2011-07-27 15:47:21 av Michiel van der Vlist (2:280/5555)
     Kommentar till en text av Janis Kracht (1:261/38)
Ärende: FidoNews 28:30 [02/05]: Guest Editorial
===============================================
Hello Janis,

On Tuesday July 26 2011 09:46, you wrote to me:

 >>> I couldn't agree with you more.  However, since the eurotrash hold

 JK> [...]

 JK> That is a direct spill over from this pathetic echo and a general
 JK> feeling of disgust with what is going on HERE.

And that makes it all right? When it is done by one of YOURS in YOUR echo in
frustration it is all right? Whereas when it done by one of ours, in
frustration of what happen to us it is not?  You are measuring with two sticks
Janis.

 JK> Beyond which, you have no idea how things are handled in that echo as
 JK> far as moderation is concerned.

Just as you have no idea how the moderation in THIS echo is handled. Björn
moderates in private you know...

 JK> FidoGazette isn't mentioned in P4 as Fidonews is,

FidoNews, the magazine. NOT the echo.

 JK>  making it the "official document" and ADMIN echo in Fidonet.

Admin echo in Fidonet? What is that?

You can't have it both ways Janis. You claim that echomail is not part of
FidoNet. Then this echo is no exception. It is an echo, just like any other
echo. For which the basic rule has always been that the moderator is the sole
ruler. Don't like it? Create your own!

Which is precisely what you have done. So now that you have done that, go play
in your own sandbox and stop trying to force your ways on others.

And now that you have brought P4 in the game: Yes Fidonews is mentioned in
policy. What is not mentioned however is a procedure for removing an editor
from office. There are procedures for the removal of *C's of all levels, but
NOT for the FidoNews editor.

There is a reason for that of course. Newspaper should have no friends. The
FidoNews editor should be independent and he/she should be free to publish
articles or voice opinions that do not fall well with the *Cs. If the founding
fathers of Fidonet had meant that the editor could be removed from office, they
would have mentioned it. But they didn't. So there! Now back off please.

 >>> I'm amazed more people don't rise up here when the insults start.
 >>> Insulting other people's countries certainly defeats the purpose of
 >>> being a member of Fidonet.

 >> You are not is a very good position to complain. For YEARS, you have
 >> tolerated people like Roy and Ross that have been pouring insults
 >> like "pissant little country" and "eurotrash" over us. You remained
 >> silent.

 JK> Look to your invisible moderator.

In contrast to the invisible moderator of the FIDOGAZETTE echo?

 JK>  He's the one who can stop anything like that.

Only in here. Not in the rest of Fidonet.

 >> particpition from Germans in these so called "international echos"?
 >> It is not that there aren't any left in FidoNet. R24 is alive and
 >> kicking. It is almost as big as all of Z1. So where are they?

 JK> You really expect them to show up here, knowing that there is no
 JK> moderator? I don't.

It is not just here that they shine by absence. I see very few Germans anywhere
other than in the *.GER echos.

 JK> Yet it would seem there are some things in your mind that need
 JK> remembering,

I have said it many times before. Ik would long have been forgotten if it had
stopped then and there. But it doesn't. There was a time when Z1 dominated
FidoNet and for a variety of reasons we had to accept that. These reason for
having to accept Z1 dominance no longer apply however. Fido over IP has freed
us from the tyranny of the distributors. The shrinking of FidoNet has freed us
from the Z1 nummerical supremacy.

So the Z1 dominance is no longer accaptable. But you keep trying to force your
way of doing things on others. The very fact that you are now trying to have
the editor removed from office is another example of this annoying, no longer
acceptable behaviour.

 >> Making fidonet grow is not the job of a moderator. According to you,
 >> echomail is not even part of FidoNet...

 JK> Fidonews, the journal, is the face we show the world about Fidonet.

You really believe anyone outside FidoNet reads it. Oh, get real.

 JK> In that respect, it can and SHOULD foster growth in Fidonet,

When I read P4, I only see mention of the *Cs as the people responsible for the
growth of FidoNet. The FidoNews editor's job description does not mention it.

 JK> not discourage it.

I do not see how the way the editor handles the MAGAZINE discourages growth of
FidoNet.

Speaking of growth... I would not be so loudmouthed if I were you. How long
have you been ZC1? Ten years? Look at the nodelist archives. How much growth
has there been in Z1 during those ten years? I will tell you: it has SHRUNK by
some 90%! You have done a piss poor job. Silence would be fitting.

 JK> This echo is much the same in that respect.  It should be encouraging
 JK> member participation, not slam-dunks of the type you seem to enjoy.

Like "Eurotrash"?

 JK> Every member you drive away from this echo insures that particular
 JK> sysop will never send in an article to this dead publication.

It isn't dead yet. But even during the editorship of Donald Tees, there were
empty issues. The number of articles in FidoNews reflects the general status of
the network: that of decline. To blame the moderator of this echo for the
decline of FidoNet is ridiculous.


Cheers, Michiel

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