Text 16871, 119 rader
Skriven 2014-07-21 14:59:00 av TIM RICHARDSON (1:123/140)
     Kommentar till en text av KEES VAN EETEN
Ärende: Ukraine
===============
On 07-20-14, KEES VAN EETEN said to TIM RICHARDSON:

KV>Hello TIM!


KV>20 Jul 14 08:13, you wrote to me:


TR> First...the pilot is chiefly responsible for what the aircraft does
TR> once it leaves the ground.


KV>Yes but he can not veere of his flightplan, based on personal opinions.


Maybe. But when he's studying his flight plan prior to takeoff, and he
sees the flight plan will take him over territory where hostilities
that include aircraft being shot at with missiles, he has the option
of refusing to fly the plane.


TR> Secondly...this incident calls to mind the incident where a civilian
TR> aircraft deliberately took off and aimed its takeoff path directly
TR> at an American war ship, such that the captain of that war ship shot
TR> it down thinking it might be an enemy missile. The USS Vincennse saw
TR> a large object approaching it at a high velocity in the Persian Gulf.


TR> The captain treated the object as a hostile missile and his crew shot
TR> it down. It was an Iranian aircraft, full of Iranian passengers, and
TR> nobody misses them. Well....maybe other Iranians. Anyway, hopefully,
TR> the captain was promoted to admiral later in his career for his act
TR> of human decency (killing Iranians).


KV>As I read it the the system presented the aircraft as a hostile missile.


The Iranians deliberately sent that aircraft at an American war ship, as
an attempt to ramp up hostile feelings toward America.


KV>There was a flaw in the system, and the crew reacted as it should have.
KV>The failure of the process was admitted.


There was no disciplinary action taken against the captain or his crew.


The only `failure' in the system was the cold-blooded attitude of Iran
and most everybody in that part of the world toward human life.


The only `flaw' in the system was an unknown, un-announced aircraft
deliberately took off heading straight at an American war ship.


By the way....as I recall, there was a procedure in place for civilian
aircraft taking off and landing, to notify war ships in their vicinity
of their takeoff path and landing path. Neither the aircraft of which
we speak, nor the tower under whose control it was at the time, did so.


TR> In any case...any pilot who takes a civilian aircraft over a war zone
TR> is taking a chance of being shot down. Even if it is supposedly known
TR> before hand by the combatants that civilian aircraft are liable to
TR> fly overhead in the battle zone, it is ultimately the responsibility
TR> of the pilot of the aircraft for whatever happens. If it is the usual
TR> policy of a civilian airline to route their aircraft over a combat
TR> area, then they become liable for whatever happens, both financially
TR> and morally.


KV>There are so many skirmishes in the world, that not flying  over them
KV>would make aviation impossible. Considering the equipment avalable in many
KV>of these regions, high altitude aviation is considered safe.


TR> Dealing with combatants of either Eastern Europe, or the
TR> Middle East, it is to be expected that one side or the other will do
TR> something atrocious, like shoot down a civilian aircraft with hundreds
TR> of innocents aboard, and care not a bit for the consequences. Dealing
TR> with Russians, whether of the old Soviet Union kind, or the modern-day
TR> version, the mental type is the same; they aren't known as `The Russian
TR> Bear' for nothing! By the way...isn't Putin ex-KGB? That alone says a
TR>lot.


KV>Atrocities in warzones are nor a priviledge of Eastern-Europe or the
KV>middle-East.


TR> And there is already precedent for this; it was Russian war planes
TR> that
TR> stalked and shot down a Korean airliner, back in the 1980's.


KV>That is almost 35 years ago. Navigation systems and warning systems cannot
KV>be compared with what is available today.


It doesn't matter if it was 35 years ago or just yesterday! That pilot could
see what he was about to fire on was a civilian airliner. He fired on it
anyway!


Later...when the tragedy began to unfold in the international press and media,
the Russians `claimed' it was a `spy' plane loaded with electronic spying
equipment!


They lied. The pilot knew exactly what he was doing. My feeling is it wasn't
`him' who took the decision to do what he did, that it came from much
higher up, and was pre-planned for quite some time.


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