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Möte OSDEBATE, 18996 texter

Text 496, 216 rader
Skriven 2004-09-08 00:03:06 av Rich (1:379/45)
    Kommentar till text 492 av Mike '/m' (1:379/45)
Ärende: Re: Spammers faster than the good guys....
==================================================
From: "Rich" <@>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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   How so?

   How can you tell?

Rich

  "Mike '/m'" <mike@barkto.com> wrote in message =
news:42bsj0pr92t02pld8mf43j4ajalcj8q14a@4ax.com...
  At this point in time, I no longer see any benefit from the =
publication of my
  SPF info. =20

   /m<fwiw>



  On Mon, 6 Sep 2004 20:56:36 -0400, "Geo." <georger@nls.net> wrote:

  >I claimed for mike to benefit, everyone else on the planet (or at =
least a vast
  >majority) would have to implement spf checking.
  >
  >Geo.
  >
  >"Rich" <@> wrote in message news:413c9097$1@w3.nls.net...
  >   So then you do believe that mike miller has benefited from =
publishing his
  >specification?
  >
  >   Or are you just whining again that your imagined claims are =
flawed?
  >
  >Rich
  >
  >  "Geo." <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:413c8047$1@w3.nls.net...
  >  No, I'm saying that the vast majority of postmasters view SPF as a =
spam
  >  stopping technology which it is not, because they use the existence =
of an SPF
  >  text record as part of the scoring for emails the spammers have =
learned that
  >  they can reduce their scores by providing that text record and =
that's exactly
  >  what is happening.
  >
  >  The flip side of the coin is that SPF was designed to prevent =
backscatter
  >  "attacks" but these weren't really attacks, the spammers just need =
a way to
  >  redirect backscatter away from themselves and SPF provides nothing =
to stop
  >them
  >  from continuing to do that.
  >
  >  Geo.
  >
  >  "Rich" <@> wrote in message news:413c6d08$1@w3.nls.net...
  >     so you are claiming that mike miller's domain has had DNS =
spoofed to
  >change
  >  the records to allow spam from his domain?
  >
  >  Rich
  >
  >    "Geo." <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:413c676d$3@w3.nls.net...
  >    "Rich" <@> wrote in message news:413abecc@w3.nls.net...
  >
  >    >>   Furthermore, are you claiming that spammers are actually =
doing what
  >  george
  >    claimed which is to create their own domains and point their MX =
records at
  >  your
  >    SMTP server?  This latter should be simple to verify since the =
NDRs you
  >  receive
  >    would be for the spammer's domains and not yours and you can see =
their MX
  >    records.<<
  >
  >    What the spammers are doing is following their spambots with =
dynamic spf
  >DNS
  >    entries.
  >
  >    Geo.
  >
  >
  >

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.3790.186" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; How so?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; How can you =
tell?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV>"Mike '/m'" &lt;<A =
href=3D"mailto:mike@barkto.com">mike@barkto.com</A>&gt;=20
  wrote in message <A=20
  =
href=3D"news:42bsj0pr92t02pld8mf43j4ajalcj8q14a@4ax.com">news:42bsj0pr92t=
02pld8mf43j4ajalcj8q14a@4ax.com</A>...</DIV>At=20
  this point in time, I no longer see any benefit from the publication =
of=20
  my<BR>SPF info.&nbsp; <BR><BR>&nbsp;/m&lt;fwiw&gt;<BR><BR><BR><BR>On =
Mon, 6=20
  Sep 2004 20:56:36 -0400, "Geo." &lt;<A=20
  href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>&gt; =
wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I=20
  claimed for mike to benefit, everyone else on the planet (or at least =
a=20
  vast<BR>&gt;majority) would have to implement spf=20
  checking.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Geo.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"Rich" &lt;@&gt; wrote in =
message=20
  <A=20
  =
href=3D"news:413c9097$1@w3.nls.net">news:413c9097$1@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR>=
&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  So then you do believe that mike miller has benefited from publishing=20
  his<BR>&gt;specification?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Or are you just =
whining=20
  again that your imagined claims are=20
  flawed?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Rich<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; "Geo." &lt;<A=20
  href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>&gt; wrote in =
message <A=20
  =
href=3D"news:413c8047$1@w3.nls.net">news:413c8047$1@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR>=
&gt;&nbsp;=20
  No, I'm saying that the vast majority of postmasters view SPF as a=20
  spam<BR>&gt;&nbsp; stopping technology which it is not, because they =
use the=20
  existence of an SPF<BR>&gt;&nbsp; text record as part of the scoring =
for=20
  emails the spammers have learned that<BR>&gt;&nbsp; they can reduce =
their=20
  scores by providing that text record and that's exactly<BR>&gt;&nbsp; =
what is=20
  happening.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; The flip side of the coin is that SPF =
was=20
  designed to prevent backscatter<BR>&gt;&nbsp; "attacks" but these =
weren't=20
  really attacks, the spammers just need a way to<BR>&gt;&nbsp; redirect =

  backscatter away from themselves and SPF provides nothing to=20
  stop<BR>&gt;them<BR>&gt;&nbsp; from continuing to do=20
  that.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Geo.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; "Rich" =
&lt;@&gt; wrote=20
  in message <A=20
  =
href=3D"news:413c6d08$1@w3.nls.net">news:413c6d08$1@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR>=
&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  so you are claiming that mike miller's domain has had DNS spoofed=20
  to<BR>&gt;change<BR>&gt;&nbsp; the records to allow spam from his=20
  domain?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Rich<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
"Geo."=20
  &lt;<A href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>&gt; wrote =
in message=20
  <A=20
  =
href=3D"news:413c676d$3@w3.nls.net">news:413c676d$3@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR>=
&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  "Rich" &lt;@&gt; wrote in message <A=20
  =
href=3D"news:413abecc@w3.nls.net">news:413abecc@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR>&gt;=
<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &gt;&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Furthermore, are you claiming that spammers are =
actually=20
  doing what<BR>&gt;&nbsp; george<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; claimed =
which is to=20
  create their own domains and point their MX records at<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  your<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; SMTP server?&nbsp; This latter should =
be simple=20
  to verify since the NDRs you<BR>&gt;&nbsp; =
receive<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  would be for the spammer's domains and not yours and you can see their =

  MX<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  records.&lt;&lt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; What the spammers =
are doing=20
  is following their spambots with dynamic=20
  spf<BR>&gt;DNS<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  entries.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
Geo.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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