Text 24297, 263 rader
Skriven 2006-11-02 06:34:00 av Jeff Binkley (1:226/600)
Kommentar till en text av Gary Braswell
Ärende: Election
================
GB> JB>>>>> Two simple questions.
GB> JB>>>>> 1. Do the terrorists want us to leave Iraq ?
GB> JB>>>>> 2. Which party has the most members publicly talking about
GB> JB>>>>> a hasty withdraw ?
GB> GB>>>> I don't think the terrorists want us to leave Iraq. But if we
GB> GB>>>> do they will claim victory. The same way Saddam did after the
GB> GB>>>> Gulf War.
GB> JB>>> That doesn't make any sense. If they don't want us to leave
GB> JB>>> then why are they fighting us ?
GB> GB>> Its pretty obvious and simple. They want to kill us. They want
GB> GB>> to destroy us.
GB> GB>> Where else in the world can they get at us so easily? Kill us
GB> GB>> in numbers they have not been able to since 9/11 and do it on a
GB> GB>> daily basis and show the US is not invulnerable on
GB> GB>> international TV.
GB> GB>> Its a bonanza from their point of view.
GB> JB> I see. So they don't want us to leave and they see great
GB> JB> terrorist victories in killing a few US servicemen without it
GB> JB> making much in the way of news. Got it. That really doesn't
GB> JB> fit the pattern of most terrorists and most terrorists aren't
GB> JB> real excited about taking on a well armed military.
GB>Of course they don't take on a well armed military in a
GB>out-in-the-open fight, terrorists never do if they can avoid it for
GB>obvious reasons. But bombs, sniping, etc. they do carry out and while
GB>the casualties are low compared to other wars, it has an effect back
GB>home. Chaos, division, infighting, etc hopefully making their enemy
GB>weaker. It also makes them big guys in the eyes of the people who
GB>hate the US.
Which would include those living in the US who also hate or loathe this
country. They sound just like those who live outside of the US, who hate
this country.
GB> GB>>>> Ready made and available US targets, not to mention a huge
GB> GB>>>> recruiting situation makes our stay there a welcome one to
GB> GB>>>> the hierarchy of terror outfits.
GB> JB>>> That makes no sense. They don't need us there to stir up
GB>hatred GB>> of the
GB> GB>> It makes plenty of sense.
GB> GB>> They may not need us there to stir hatred of the US, but as
GB> GB>> long as we are there, the hatred grows and spreads in an order
GB> GB>> of magnitude and more importantly, since they can paint us as
GB> GB>> invaders, conquerors they can get more people to actually come
GB> GB>> in and fight.
GB> JB> You have bought into the propaganda of the left well.
GB>Its not from the left.
Didn't say you were. Just said you are preaching much of what they do.
GB>You mean to tell me masses of the Arab world does not see us as
GB>invaders, conquerors in Iraq? Our being there does not give the
GB>radicals fuel for the fire?
Nope. I don't see the entire Arab world coming to the aid of the
terrorists. If they were, then I might believe this. Much of the Arab
world is actually helping us or staying out of the way.
GB>Instead it makes them think we are liberators, calms them and makes
GB>them welcome us as friends?
GB>I am not saying we are conquerors, of course we are not. I am talking
GB>about their perception through the dishonest propaganda of the terror
GB>brokers. That leads to more hate and more people willing to join them
GB>and more jihaddis willing to throw their lives away.
Propaganda will always be propaganda. You are suggesting we can control
it.
GB>By saying this I am not justifying us leaving or not trying to win.
GB>Its just a fact.
GB>We must stay and we must win. Over time, I hope they will see as
GB>their dead continue to rise and we go nowhere, the terror brokers
GB>will lose power and influence by seeing despite their efforts and
GB>dead piling up, we are still there.
GB>The Japanese of WWII blamed us for them attacking us because we
GB>embargoed them. They vilified us in their public as strangling them
GB>to death.
GB>That is a fact. It does not mean I agree with their point.
It also took many many years, after WWII for Japan and germany to get to
calm. We need patience and not let our actions be dictated to us by the
Arab or any other media outlet.
GB>They would not have been embargoed, nor would they have had such a
GB>huge need for oil, etc. had they not been trying to establish The
GB>Greater Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere at the point of a gun in China.
GB>We got attacked for taking a moral stand against an evil regime.
GB>We are being attacked in Iraq for much the same reasons.
GB>To deny it because of a political fear of giving Democrats some
GB>disengenuous purchase they can use to pound the Republicans with is
GB>wacked.
GB>And I know Democrats have used that as a bludgeon. And a disengenuous
GB>one at that.
GB>But then denying reality just to refuse the Democrats some ammo, IMO,
GB>makes it far worse for anyone with any common sense.
GB>Any time you fight the enemy it gives them propaganda to use to help
GB>their cause.
GB>But fight you must.
GB>Just because I am stating a fact does not mean I am learning from the
GB>left, supporting them or agreeing with them in their disengenuous use
GB>of that fact.
GB>I hope I have cleared that up.
GB> JB>>> US. Aside from bragging to a buddy, what value is killing a
GB> JB>>> US soldier in Iraq to a terrorist ? Terrorists, most of all,
GB> JB>>> want major publicity. Attacking a major US asset will give
GB> JB>>> them that visibility. Killing a few US soldiers won't.
GB> GB>> Without a doubt, killing US troops is not as sexy to terrorists
GB> GB>> as blowing something up on US soil.
GB> GB>> But if its all you have, you make the best out of it and they
GB> GB>> are.
GB> JB> It isn't all they have but it is all that they have accomplished
GB> JB> under Bush.
GB>And we can thank God for that.
GB> GB>>>> I think the Bath remnants want is to leave. I think the
GB> GB>>>> religious factions want us to leave and I think a growing
GB> GB>>>> number of Iraqis want us to leave.
GB> GB>>>> Bin Laden wanted us out of the Holy Lands. We are now, but he
GB> GB>>>> is still after us.
GB> JB>>> The last time I checked, Bin Laden was still considered to be
GB> JB>>> the leader of Al Qaeda.
GB> GB>> I agree. So what is your point?
GB> JB> So on one hand you say that the terrorists want us to stay and
GB> JB> on the other, you say that the leader of Al Qaeda wants us to
GB> JB> leave.
GB>OBL claimed he became our enemy when we took up residence in Saudi
GB>Arabia. He implied if we left, he would leave us alone.
GB>Older terror outfits hit us they claimed because we supported Israel.
GB>Still others wanted us out of the Mideast.
GB>Now most want us out of the Mideast they claim.
GB>Its gone beyond that, if really there was any truth to it in the
GB>first place. If we packed up and left everywhere in the Mideast, they
GB>would still come after us. They hate us for what we are and what we
GB>have. They always have really and have used various claims of hurt to
GB>justify to the world their efforts against us. It hate and revenge.
GB> GB>>>> They want us now out of the Middle East completely and that
GB> GB>>>> will not even be enough if we did leave.
GB> GB>>>> Its gone beyond all that now.
GB> JB>>> If they never wanted us dead, they wouldn't have attacked us
GB> JB>>> in the first place. You're joining the crowd that makes this
GB> JB>>> the all fault of the US. Sad to see.
GB> GB>> You lost me here.
GB> GB>> I never said they did not want us dead. Various factions have
GB> GB>> attacked us for many reasons. We support Israel, we intervene
GB> GB>> in the Middle East, we exist...
GB> GB>> I don't blame the US. I don't know where you got that from.
GB> JB>>> I look at it as simply as I would rather kill a terrorist in
GB> JB>>> Baghdad than in downtown New York.
GB> GB>> Same here, but killing them anywhere is fine by me.
GB> GB>> You have to understand Jeff, they feel the same about the US.
GB> GB>> They would rather kill many in the US in one fell swoop, but if
GB> GB>> they can't, what we have in Iraq will do fine for now.
GB> GB>> Until the Iraqis are able to fight for their own country, we
GB> GB>> are in a war of attrition in Iraq. Sure we kill more of them.
GB> GB>> But they don't care.
GB> JB> Right, the endless supply theory and wars never end. They will
GB> JB> fight for their country or they will be killed and enslaved.
GB> JB> Given that choice, they will fight. Look at how many policeman
GB> JB> have gotten killed yet more keep signing up. You forget that
GB> JB> side of the equation.
GB>I have not forgotten that hope. I don't think its with the police
GB>though. The biggest disappointment is with the police over there.
GB>Joblessness is big over there. Many show up for their 1st check and
GB>disappear. That check they can survive for some time on. US units
GB>don't trust police, they keep their guns trained on them.
GB>The army is the hope there.
Yep, and we need to give them time to finish the job. The left is
fueling the hopes of our enemies that we will soon cut and run. They
don't need hope. They need despair and hopelessness. An enemy will
stop fighting when they lose the will to fight or feel the situation is
hopeless.
GB> GB>> Its my belief we are going to have to be in Iraq for 20 years
GB> GB>> or more if we want to do the job right.
GB> GB>> We are going to have to have an entire generation grow up that
GB> GB>> knows nothing else but democracy and freedom. They will fight
GB> GB>> and die for it. Now we have a largely tribal and split
GB> GB>> religious culture used to living in horrible circumstances with
GB> GB>> massive corruption that has been the fabric of their country
GB> GB>> for decades.
GB> JB> They have had 2,000 years of being conquered and tyranny. Of
GB> JB> course it is going to take that long. It took longer for Japan
GB> JB> and Germany. I am just glad that our parents were more patient
GB> JB> than some I see nowadays.
GB>We have been spoiled on short conflicts.
Yep.
Jeff
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