Text 27535, 134 rader
Skriven 2007-02-27 18:06:52 av Ed Hulett (1:123/789.0)
     Kommentar till en text av VERN HUMPHREY (1:123/140)
Ärende: Presidential race
=========================
VERN HUMPHREY -> ED HULETT wrote:
 VH>>> Taking an example off the top of my head, George Allen of
 VH> Virginia was
 VH>>> redistricted out of his congressional seat -- he ran for
 VH> governor and
 VH>>> won, and then for the senate.

 EH>> Okay. That was in Virginia.

 VH> And in many another state.  The North Carolina case, where two areas
 VH> were conneceted by the interstate, the district bourndary drawn so it
 VH> ran up one shoulder of the road and down the other is a good example.

We are talking about Washington, not some other state.

 VH>>> In Texas, the Republican legislature challenged the districts as
 VH> drawn
 VH>>> by the Democrats when they were in the majority, and redrew them.

 EH>> I remember that. The Dems were so nice as to leave the state in
 VH> protest. The
 EH>> should have stayed out.

 VH>>> What do you mean, "Not like you claim?" I claim it has been redrawn
 VH>>> every 10 years.  Are you saying it has NOT been redrawn?  That
 VH> would
 VH>>> contradict your statement above.  Or are you saying it was NOT
 VH> redrawn
 VH>>> based on the census?

 EH>> No, I never said it has not been redrawn, I said the changes were
 VH> minor and
 EH>> reflected population movement.

 VH> Bingo!  ALL districts are redrawn every 10 years.

They have to be because of population movement.

 VH> And SOME districts are redrawn for political advantage.

Yes, some are.

 VH>>> So?  The point I am making is that majority parties use
 VH> redistricting t
 VH>>> STAY in the majority and hold down the other party.

 EH>> The minority parties can make those claims all they want, but they
 VH> have to
 EH>> attract voters on their merrits.

 VH> Riiiight -- except those sitting representatives who aren't ALLOWED to
 VH> attract voters because they've been redistricted out of their seat.

That hasn't happened here.

 VH>>> So?  The fact that it doesn't happen in your back yard doesn't
 VH> mean it
 VH>>> doesn't happen.

 EH>> Sheesh! We were talking about *my back yard*.

 VH> No, we were talking about the Constitution of the United States.

Whatever...

 VH>>> Well, condoning violations of the Constitution certainly WON'T
 VH> make the
 VH>>> honest!!

 EH>> No one is condoning violations of the Constitution.

 VH> When one accepts obstacles to getting on the ballot NOT in the
 VH> Constitution, one is condoning violations of the Constitution.

No one is accepting obstacles not in the Constitution.

 VH>>> The essense of the Constitution, Ed, is that it assumes
 VH> politicians are
 VH>>> NOT honest.  It therefore seeks to control and rein them in.

 EH>> Is that right? Where does it make that assumption?

 VH> It's called the checks and balances system.

The assumption isn't that politicians are inherently dishonest. The assumption
is that power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

 VH>>> If you let them violate the Constitution, you give up all
 VH> protection.

 EH>> Who is letting them violate the Constitution?

 VH> Those who poo-poo violations like using districting to keep people off
 VH> the ballot.

Who would that be?

 VH>>> Ed?  We are talking about the Constitiution, which means we are
 VH> talking
 VH>>> about the whole of the United States, not just your back yard.

 EH>> Nope, this started as a discussion about my back yard.

 VH> Your back yard is not the Constitution.

Good grief...

 VH>>> And that's worth trashing the Constitution for?

 EH>> No one is "trashing the Constitution."

 VH> When you allow people to put obstacles to getting on the ballot that are
 VH> not in the Constitution, you are trashing the Constitution.

No one is allowing people to put obstacles to getting on the ballot that are
not in the Constitution.

Ed

-- 
"But the safety of the people of America against dangers from
foreign force depends not only on their forbearing to give
just causes of war to other nations, but also on their placing
and continuing themselves in such a situation as not to invite
hostility or insult; for it need not be observed that there are
pretended as well as just causes of war."

-- John Jay (Federalist No. 4)

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