Text 8061, 73 rader
Skriven 2006-09-10 23:22:00 av Robert E Starr JR (8558.babylon5)
Ärende: Re: OT: B5 actor sighting
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* * * This message was from Amy Guskin to rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.m * * *
         * * * and has been forwarded to you by Lord Time * * *         
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<0001HW.C127604203F0EB82F0407530@news.verizon.net><0001HW.C127669E03F26935F0407530@news.verizon.net><kurtullman-013B7C.1

>> On Sat, 9 Sep 2006 21:01:32 -0400, kruegerb76@hotmail.com wrote
(in article <1157850092.269756.304930@d34g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>):

> Don't apologize for giving a thorough answer.  It's appreciated.
> 
> Amy Guskin wrote:
>> The shamanic journey, which is the main tool of the shaman, is a
>> very specific technique whereby you send your spirit body (as opposed to 
>> your
>> physical and mental bodies) out into what we refer to as the "non-ordinary
>> reality," there to exchange energy in some way with spirit guides/allies.  
>> An
>> energy exchange can be a discussion, a grant of information (e.g. finding
>> lost keys, which I've actually done for people!), a healing, a gift of some
>> sort, a soul retrieval, an extraction or depossession, etc. etc.  The 
>> journey
>> itself is effected in different ways, but the usual methods are by aural
>> driver (usually drumming, or a drone of some kind), or by entheogen
>> (mushrooms or other plants or drugs).  Personally, I'm a drug-free shaman,
>> but I know some people who use them and it seems to be equally effective.
> 
> 
> That sounds a bit like a Vision Quest.  Or am I way oof, again?  LOL <<

Well, yes and no.  With a vision quest, it's generally more about putting 
your body through a prolonged period of deprivation and strain in order to 
deliberately cause hallucinations and visions.  A long-running joke among my 
friends has been that I'd have to bring my laptop on a vision quest, so you'd 
get blog entries or e-mails  like, "Vision Quest, Day 6: starting to hear 
voices not my own.  Can't make out most of the words, but have Googled the 
ones that I _can_ make out..."   :-)

With journeying, it's a short-term event rather than an endurance one.  You 
drum for fifteen or twenty minutes, then lie down and cover your eyes, and 
either someone drums for you, or you use a tape or a CD, and those generally 
last no longer than a half an hour.  So, you're deliberately choosing to 
journey at a particular time, seeking to enter the journey state, and you 
leave it at a time of your choosing.  With a vision quest, there's no telling 
how long it'll take to 'get it.'

Also, with journeying, you are generally setting your own agenda (although 
the spirits may have something else in mind once you get to the non-ordinary 
reality!).  With a vision quest, you're in a wholly receptive mode, a 
'sacrificial posture' if you will.

So, while both involve the deliberate seeking of visions, they differ in 
duration, intent, and likely outcome, and you'd undertake them for very 
different reasons.  Journeying is more like having a "to-do" list to handle; 
a vision quest is more about moving to a different level in your spiritual 
practice.

This is not to say that you can't do the "big questions" in a journey; but 
conversely, you would _not_ do a vision quest to handle the "to-do" list sort 
of things that you'd handle in journeys.

Also, vision quests are personal matters only.  You wouldn't do a vision 
quest to heal someone else, but shamanic journeying is historically used for 
working on other peoples' stuff.  Its use as a self-help tool is a relatively 
new, western concept.

Amy
                                                                               
                    
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