Text 22396, 116 rader
Skriven 2012-03-14 14:36:00 av Glen Jamieson
     Kommentar till en text av Hap Newsom
Ärende: SILENT SERVICE 20314
============================
 -=> Quoting Hap Newsom to Glen Jamieson <=-

Greetings Hap,

 ->  ->  -> And now they are talking about replacements.  Suggestions that

 ->  -> They claim that we have learnt a lot of lessons from building the
 ->  -> Collins, and now we could do a better job.
 ->  
 ->  -> "Shallow" is relative.  According to what I have read of the
 ->  -> discussions, even the 5500t French Barracuda class, with 8.8 m beam 
 ->  -> considered too large to operate in littoral (brown) waters.  Only
 ->  -> smaller, non-nuclear subs fit this role.  They have to be capable of
 ->  -> operating at only 2 knots above an irregular seabed, or sit on the
 ->  -> bottom for extended periods.  They also have to be capable of long
 ->  -> distance travel, and be cheap enough for Australia to afford.  They
 ->  -> say a nuclear sub would cost as much as several conventional ones.
 ->  ->
 ->  HN> US nuclear attack subs have worked in littoral 
 ->  HN> waters for years. However I would not recommend
 ->  HN> them as a regular diet. I suppose it would also
 ->  HN> depend on the river as well. Some are wide and 
 ->  HN> deep enough that many boats could navigate 
 ->  HN> them with out being detected. 

My personal view is that Australia doesn't need submarines.  Any
seaborne invasion force would be detected long before arrival, and
dealt with by air or surface defence.  Considering the most recent
naval skirmish, in the Falklands, were submarines used?  I think it
was all aircraft and ship to ship missiles.

 ->  -> And, of course, above all else, politics comes into it.
 ->  -> 
 ->  HN> No getting around that...which may mean
 ->  HN> the OZ navy will be once again saddled
 ->  HN> with a sub that it's difficult to even 
 ->  HN> get a crew to man her. As it is the 
 ->  HN> Collins class boats have a hard time
 ->  HN> getting people to volunteer to crew them.
 -> 
 -> If all the Collins boats were in working order at the same time, there
 -> would not be enough crews to man them.
 ->
 HN> And so far that has never happened.

Right!
 
 ->  -> Long range may not be needed in Sweden, but Australia is bigger,
 ->  -> bigger.  And the Pacific Ocean is rather empty.
 ->  ->
 ->  HN> I said there's not much need for 
 ->  HN> a huge range, not that the boats
 ->  HN> are not capable of it. They run

 ->  HN> run them as brown water boats
 ->  HN> or deep sea boats? The Gotlands
 ->  HN> can do both, but they are not 
 ->  HN> designed to be deep water boats
 ->  HN> primarily. Provisions for the 
 ->  HN> crew would be a bigger factor 
 ->  HN> than the range of the boat itself.
 -> 
 -> Can you drag a trawl net with those boats?  Lots of prawns in the
 -> waters around Australia to feed the crew.
 ->
 HN> The biggest problem with the coastal 
 HN> waters of OZ, are two fold...clear
 HN> water makes hiding difficult, and 
 HN> all those dang coral reefs make 
 HN> navigation a bugaboo! Many subs
 HN> have capabilities to "launch" divers
 HN> so you would not need a net!

I can just picture the mess divers out collecting the oysters,
scallops and abalones for the evening meal...
 
 -> Ship building is not doing well in Eastern Australia, but in the West
 -> they are building large, 40 knot catamaran transports for the US Navy,
 -> using a factory in USA to complete the first order of 12.

 HN> That would be AUSTAL...and they have 
 HN> shipyards in the USA as well, Norfolk
 HN> for one I think and I think the other
 HN> is on the gulf coast somewhere

Yes.  I travelled on an Austal catamaran ferry from Athens to
Santorini island in '06.  It was fast and comfortable, and the wide
upper deck gave good viewing.  Ten minutes was enough time to dock and
load/unload at Io island.

MMMMM----- Recipe via Meal-Master (tm) v8.05
 
      Title: Oysters Birtley
 Categories: Oysters
      Yield: 4 Servings
 
      2    Avocados
           Juice 1 small lemon
     20    Sydney rock oysters
           Salt and pepper 1
           Dessertspoon dry white wine
           Brown bread and butter
 
  Halve the avocados, scoop out some of the centre, including both
  stones, sprinkle lightly with salt and lemon juice. Fill each avocado
  half with 5 Sydney rock oysters. Sprinkle with wine and pepper. Allow
  to stand for 4 to 5 hours. Serve well chilled with brown bread and
  butter. From: Carol Bryant Date: 12-07-02
 
MMMMM
 

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