Text 16991, 219 rader
Skriven 2005-11-25 22:17:00 av FRANK SCHEIDT (1:123/140)
Kommentar till en text av WARD DOSSCHE
Ärende: Wars
============
-=> Quoting Ward Dossche to Frank Scheidt <=-
> That makes no difference to the anti-America crew with their wild
> ideas. *Anything* the US does is *bad*. Anything GWB says is a
> "lie".
WD>
WD> There's only one country in the world which had a quite successful
WD> TV-show about its leadership. The TV-show was called "That's my Bush"
WD> ... made in America, funded by American capital, first broadcast in
WD> America, ...
Yeah, so "successful" it was located on a tiny (at that time) TV
channel, The Comedy Channel. After a few months it folded ... I
saw a bit of it ... it was really *dumb* ... it protrayed
George W. Bush as being *stupid* when we all know he's a very
bright guy!
WD> The most vocal person about GWB is an American: Michael Moore!
Most of his statements against the US have been thoroughly
discredited. Have you noted he's seldom in public view these
days. That's because even *liberals* have become disgusted with
his antiquated views.
WD> The most successful anti-GWB person is an American.
Who is *that*? And successful in what way?
WD> Stand-up commedians in New York are grateful for the material their
WD> president provides them on a regular basis.
It doesn't matter *who* is president Jay Leno and Dave Letterman
have their writers come up with some really funny stuff. After
all, that's what they're paid to do -- make the audience laugh.
WD> I guess you never notice how well the world likes to make fun of other
WD> leaders as well ... Granny from England and Charlie her son are a
WD> God-sent present when it comes to that.
I thought Queen Elisabeth, herself, was fairly-well respected in
Britain. Her *family*, of course is a total disaster! As a
child, during WWII, her parents, King George VI and Queen
Elizabeth, kept their family in London despite the massive
bombings. That was a very, very wise public-relation move!
WD> Our stand-up comedians have a
WD> field day about our royal household and fill theatres with people just
WD> on that single subject. Never heard about "The President's brain is
WD> missing"? Have a guess who that was about... We also thanked the world
WD> for someone as stupid as Dan Quayle.
Actually Dan Quayle is quite intelligent. Here's what typically
happens, the "news"media will spot some out-of-line action by a
president or vice president -- almost *always* a Republican
president since the "news"media are slanted to the liberal side.
They'll then pound that idea into the ground so often that many
people will start to believe it.
One example is Gerald Ford who was depicted as a hopelessly
clumsy individual, based on one incident -- he stumbled one
time when getting out of an airplane. The fact was he was a
good athlete in college ... to the "news"media, however, he was a
very clumsy person.
Dan Quayle was pilloried mercilessly for his potato/potatoe
spelling as though that was extremely important. Then he
was ridiculed for allegedly saying he wished he spoke Latin
so he could converse with the Latin Americans -- not too
long after *that* came out a reporter *admitted* she had
made it up on a dull day ... and so it goes.
WD> And haven't you noticed ... nobody makes jokes about Cheney. There's a
WD> reason for that ... you like him or you hate him, but he's respected
WD> all over.
OK ...
WD> I suppose you haven't heard that former dictator Pinochet from
WD> Argentina is only sued in one country worldwide for his crimes against
WD> humanity ... Belgium ... and that all others, including the mightiest
WD> country on earth, turn a blind eye. Of course, it's a rarely overlooked
WD> footnote in world history how Pinochet rose to power.
When the US doesn't do something with international consequences
it's in our own interest. What might seem simple can have large
political consequences. Pinochet is an old man, almost dead.
Let him alone. He might have died of old-age even as we write
about him. Let him live in peace, even though *he* didn't give
that option to many others when he was in power.
> I think what *really* bothers them is something they
> cannot admit: That we saved Europe in *two* World Wars.
>
WD> The US "significantly contributed" but please do not overdo it. For
WD> WW1 there are quite accurate numbers here with 30,912 known American
WD> graves and 4,452 MIA-names on 8 memorials.
WD>
WD> The American Flanders Fields cemetary in Waregem (Belgium) has 368
WD> grave sites and the names of 43 men MIA.
WD>
WD> Compare that for example to the Menen Gate memorial in Ypres dedicated
WD> to the British with over 54,000 names of MIA's alone who died before
WD> Aug.16 1917. Tyne Cot cemetary carries the names of another 35,000
WD> Commonwealth MIA's who died since since Aug.17 1917. That is over
WD> 90,000 Commonwealth MIA's alone in an area smaller than Manhattan ...
WD> compare that to the 43 MIA US soldiers 20 miles down the road and it is
WD> obvious who contributed the most.
The number of casualties of the French and English during WWI
*naturally* will exceed those of the American dead since France
and England were involved in the dreaded "trench-warfare" for
*years*, I believe it was Marshal Haig who insisted on the
pointless charge and counter-charge over "No Man's Land"
resulted in tremendous casualties. He simply ignored the effect
of the *modern* weapon, the machine gun.
When the Americans entered WWI General Pershing *refused* to
get stuck in that mess. For that reason and because
we were in the war for a far shorter time period we had far fewer
casualties than did the French and British.
WD> Please do not overdo the effort, the US contributed significantly but
WD> did not win that war by itself. Every single casualty is one too many,
WD> the British and French suffered the most.
Largely in "No Man's Land" in WWI ...
WD> Germans suffered as well ... there are 48,000 graves alone in Vladslo
WD> near Diksmuide. Please come to Belgium, I'll gladly take you to visit
WD> the killing-fields and make you realise perhaps that war is not a
WD> popularity contest. You served for which I thank you, but it seems you
WD> have not grasped the enormity of the event in which you were engulfed
WD> at the time.
I think I had a good idea as to what went on ... I read
everything I could get my hands on WRT WWI. My older brother and
I discussed it for hours at a time. After he was in Europe he
often wrote back to me indicating where he was, based on what we
had read as kids, both fact and fiction ...
> Similarly in WWII, we supplied the Soviets so
> they'd not sign a peace treaty with Germany and then invaded
> Normandy with some assistance from the UK. It was almost
> *entirely* American might which then defeated the Nazis.
WD>
WD> The Russians already _HAD_ a peace-treaty with the Nazis which the
WD> latter violated.
Certainly the notorious "Non-Aggression Pact of 1939" could be
considered a "peace-treaty", but I was thinking of one which
might have involved a Russian surrender in 1941 and later.
WD> You did not supply the Russians, the US sold stuff for
WD> gold. Please back-away from the rethoric of that lend-lease thing ...
WD> the Russians paid in gold for what they got.
Supplies "lent" to the British, French and Russians were *always*
referred to as "Lend-Lease". The only cash involved was
*American* cash.
WD> In Normandy slightly more Commonwealth forces were brought ashore than
WD> US forces. You've watched too many movies such as "The Longest Day" and
WD> "Saving Private Ryan" and "Band of Brothers", it created and added to
WD> the myth that the Americans did it all themselves and alone. The whole
WD> of Northern France and the lowlands of Europe were a
WD> British-Canadian-Australian-New Zealand enterprise.
WD> The US contributed significantly, it did not win that part of the war
WD> itself. Even without the US contributing the way it did, the European
WD> part would have been won.
Without US help I don't think there's any *doubt* that Hitler
would have won!
WD> Please read less propaganda and more facts
The meaning of "propaganda" is "that which must be propagated"
...
WD> ... such as the original Nazi-estimates of raw-materials they had which
WD> would've kept them going until Dec.1945 after which it would be a total
WD> and final collapse. It is chronicled in Speer's "Inside the 3rd Reich"
WD> which is to be found in any serious library, and if you do not believe
WD> that then the original documents are still in the Bundesarchiv in
WD> Berlin.
Without the entry of the U.S. the war would have been over --
with Germany as the victor -- *far* before December 1945.
Remember it took the Nazis only from June 1941 to December 1941
to advance from the Russian border to the gates of Moscow!
> WRT the Pacific War, of course, that was almost entirely an
> American operation, with a bit of help from the Australians.
WD>
WD> Granted of course ... although there was more fighting at more places
WD> by more nationalities than just Americans at Pearl Harbor, Okinawa and
WD> Iwo Jima.
The U.S. Armed Forces had people from *all* over the world,
serving under the Stars & Stripes.
WD> As for the accusation about the lack of gratitude, the archivist of
WD> the US 30th Infantry Brigade writes me the following:
WD>
WD> In some of the above Cemeteries, many of the local people
WD> have adopted a grave of a soldier who is unknown to them,
WD> but he is "their adopted son," in thanks and honor for
WD> his sacrifice in giving them their Liberty and Freedom in
WD> 1944-5. It is just amazing that these people still give
WD> thanks and pay tribute to their heroes after all these 56 years!
That is really a *touching* tribute! That clashes with what has
been said here that the American soldiers were hated throughout
Europe. My brother was in the 101st Airborne. Ten years after
the "Battle of the Bulge" the people of Belgium offered all
American veterans of that battle paid transportation to
celebrate the tenth anniversary (I believe it was the tenth).
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