Text 3099, 156 rader
Skriven 2004-12-08 11:03:23 av Roy Witt (1:10/22)
   Kommentar till text 3002 av mark lewis (1:3634/12)
Ärende: Z1B <> EP1
==================
Hello mark.

07 Dec 04 20:53, you wrote to me:


 ml>>> moved up the echomail chain and that goes back to before the Z1B
 ml>>> was thought of...

 RW>> Right, but I had forgotten what it was called then.

 ml> way back, it was just called "the backbone" and not as a title or
 ml> entity...

I didn't get a node listing until January of 96, and that's when I learned
the ropes as far as backbones are concerned. Before that, I was just a
user on a few BBS's around San Diego, not aware of anything but AUTORACE,
FLAME and the CHATTER echo. I think shortly after I was nodelisted, I ran
into Souvestre when I tried to route a message to a friend in Texas
through him. He said I had no business routing through him and after all
of the ERN talk he engaged in, I could never figure why.

 RW>> Z1B was as good as any. Wait! Does BOFAQ ring a bell. That was
 RW>> before the Z1B and Bodger and Souvestre were involved then.
 RW>> Bodger being the Z1EC who set all of the standards for the, hmmmm, .

 ml> yes, but this goes back even further... back before kohl, even... i
 ml> know you remember him... umm, oh wait... kohl came after bodger,
 ml> didn't he... well, it was long before bodger (the first? elected
 ml> Z1EC)... quite a few years, in fact...

Bodger is where I came in. Don't know how much time had passed since he
became the ZEC, but I got familiar with him early on as they (Bodger and
Souvestre) dropped the FLAME echo from distribution. At the time of the
next Z1EC election, I was in the Kohl camp and instrumental in helping
Kohl get elected and his demise as R10C afterwards. I reminisced through
the archives I have of that era, yesterday.  For my efforts, I was awarded
AOL by the FLAME echo group and a 'bad boy' reputation among the R19
sysops.

 ml>>>  the Z1B came about when john and others got together to start
 ml>>> another backbone because john left the original one due to his not
 ml>>> likeing the way some things were going or being done...

 RW>> Uh huh, when he and Seaborn finally had the last straw with
 RW>> each other.

 ml> something like that... i don't recall is bobS was involved with johnS
 ml> at that time or not... i'm wanting to say that bobS started the NAB

Both of them were part of the Z1B, then Bob started 'Fidospine' and left
the Z1B. Fidospine evolved into the NAB later. I just ran across a F'spine
SLA and none of the members who started that service are with us today,
save for Seaborn. Jim Smoot (a really cool R19 sysop) was accused of being
part of that move, abandoning R19's Souvestre and Bodger, but nobody ever
proved it AFAIK.

 ml> as an alternative to whatever johnS had going on... either way, that
 ml> was all after things were already being done as they were... johnS
 ml> and bruceB were involved in putting something down in writting to
 ml> list the expectations and activities of all sides of the mail moving
 ml> stuff...

Yeup, BOFAQ, then the SLA of the Z1B. I've got a stack of floppies here on
my desk with a lot of Fidonet history on them (went searching through my
entire floppy collection yesterday). I'll be compiling them into an
archive and then put them on a CD, so there's only one source to look at
in the future.

 RW>>>> You might recognize node 1:396/1 as a major echomail
 RW>>>> mover during that time.

 ml>>> the use of the echolist was going on years before 396/1 thought
 ml>>> about becoming a major mail mover...

 ml>>> [trim]

 RW>>>> You can also see the works of both sysops, Bodger and
 RW>>>> Sylvester in your own EP1, as they were the people who
 RW>>>> wrote the original.

 ml>>> there were others involved at that time, too...

 RW>> I used to have a copy here, but it may be on another HD that's
 RW>> out of use right now. Hell, I've got MFM HDs in storage with
 RW>> those early days on it.

 ml> yeah, me, too... and sadly, i don't think i've got any working MFM
 ml> and/or RLL cards to be able to fire those hoss' up with... possbily
 ml> but i dunno...

As I recall, I saved the RLL cards and I know that one card is still
attached to the drives, so that I wouldn't have to remember how to do it
if I wanted to revive them later. They should fire up with FD running
after they boot.

 ml> i do still have my self-built external plexiglass harddrive cabinet
 ml> that housed four (!) fullheight drives and four (!) halfheight drives
 ml> on the old 286-16 ;)

Wow! I made drive mounting hardware out of plexiglass too, but they were
all mounted in that huge cabinet with nothing in it but a MB and a few
cards. A 286-16 as well.

 RW>>>> Their version was rejected by the *Cs of this zone and

 ml>>> i think it was a bit more involved than that... ISTR that it was
 ml>>> rejected here before it ever had a chance to be presented to any
 ml>>> other zones...

 RW>> But may have been where they came up with it.

 ml> possibly... i do recall the early SLA being pretty close to EP1 but
 ml> not as all encompassing...

Anybody needing a copy of any SLA, I have found ECROC, BOFAQ, FIDOSPINE's
SLA and the Z1Bs SLA...All of which tout moderator and elist recognition.

 ml>>>  those zones were extremely small in comparison to Z1 at that
 ml>>> time... i don't recall if we had progressed as far as Z4 or Z5,
 ml>>> though... possibly... possibly not... i'll have to dig in my floppy
 ml>>> archives to see what i can find from that era...

 RW>> That'd be interesting.

 ml> you should have seen the message i posted a few hours ago about the
 ml> numbers of systems and such when P4 was passed in June of '89...

I did...interesting and proves Vlist to be in error on the 'stuffed it
down our throats' scheme he's been telling us about.

 ml> we did have Z4 at that time though it was only some 40 or so systems
 ml> (not counting hosts or hubs)...

Uh huh.

 ml>>> excellent quote, BTW... it definitely shows that it was the
 ml>>> backbone(s) that had these (disputed) requirements...

 RW>> Yeup, hopefully clearing things up a bit for those who blame
 RW>> it all on the echolist.

 ml> i doubt it... seems that some would deny being eff'd in the arse
 ml> unless/until someone produced a picture showing such... i've been
 ml> surprised by some of them before and it is always possible that
 ml> they'll surprise me/us again...

None of them can deny they didn't know about it, as Fidonews issue 15-26
explains how it was done, back in 1997, anyway.  It wasn't just the
backbones who recognized the elist, it was the R1ECC who requested that
Thom's list be given a nodelisting and recognition by the Z1C. They made
it so.



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