Text 33640, 157 rader
Skriven 2009-06-23 14:19:05 av Roy Witt (1:397/22)
  Kommentar till text 33597 av Michiel van der Vlist (2:280/5555)
Ärende: Saberi vs Blom
======================
22 Jun 09 23:37, Michiel van der Vlist wrote to Jeff Smith:

 JS>>>> "Hey there little girl, I'm a child molestor. Want to have sex?".
 JS>>>> Come on Joe.

 MV>>> I do not see you introduce yourself as a gun addict. Why is that
 MV>>> Jeff?

 JS>>     I don't need guns.

 MvdV> Denial is a typical reaction of addicts when confronted with their
 MvdV> addiction.

You analogy is a bit cockeyed. When he said he 'didn't need guns', it
wasn't meant as a denial, it was meant as not having an overwelming desire
to possess guns. Which makes him normal.

 MvdV> We have been through this before. In my POV you are a gun addict.

In my POV, you're an idiot in thinking that everyone who has a different
POV from yours is an addict.

 MvdV> Of course you see it different, so you do not introduce yourself as
 MvdV> one.

Nor should he need to.

 MV>>> I will give you a hint. Blom did not introduce himself as a child
 MV>>> molestor because by OUR definition he is not. And he was here
 MV>>> when he introduced himself.

 JS>>    So I understand better.

 MvdV> What is there to understand?

Nothing really. Blom didn't introduce himself as a child molestor because
he knew that wouldn't fly, even if she was a 5yo.

 MvdV> In this country one is not a child molestor until one has actually
 MvdV> done something to a child.

Here, he's considered to be a danger to children because he made sexual
overtures to a child. Successful or not, that's illegal here and earns him
the title of Child Molestor.

 MvdV> Where is the child that Blom molested?

Blom wasn't arrested for molesting a child, he just earned the title by
his actions.

 JS>> An adult there who desires and acts upon those desires to have sex
 JS>> with a child of say 10-14 years is legal and approved of there?

 MvdV> Why do you change the rules on the fly? Why do you now say "10-14
 MvdV> years"?

Ok, 14. Now answer the question.

 MvdV> Let me say this. (But you already knew this) Sex with a fourteen
 MvdV> year is not illegal if the parents do not object.

Of course, what Child Molestor would ever forget to ask for permission.

If that's the norm there, why didn't Blom ask the US 14yo for her parental
permission?

 JS>>>>    May the cop thought a child molester is a child molester.
 JS>>>> Regardless of who they are or where they may be from.

 MV>>> And where it went wrong is that he included "no matter where they
 MV>>> are".

 JS>>     It shouldn't matter where they are or what country they come
 JS>> from.

 MvdV> It should matter where they are.

Of course it matters where they are. If they're not on US territorial
ground, they may have violated US law, but no US law enforcement officer
can arrest him because he has no jurisdiction there.

So, was Blom arrested by a US LEO in Holland?

 MvdV> It matters if they are in a country where they are not child
 MvdV> molestors.

If you have adults fucking 14yo girls, you've got child molestors in your
country.

 MvdV> If the cop still goes after them despite the fact that where they
 MvdV> are they are not child molestors, they are putting their laws above
 MvdV> that of another country.

OK, so if Blom was arrested in Holland, we apoligize and it won't happen
again. In fact, I'll be glad to pay any fines he was forced to pay if he
was.

 MvdV> That is a breach of souvreignty.

LOL! That might be a breach of souverenty if, *-IF-* Blom was arrested on
Dutch territory.

 JS>> What should matter is if and when a US law is broken on US soil.

 MvdV> Blom was not in US soil and so had not broken any law there when
 MvdV> the cop laid his trap.

Actually, Blom had broken a law here and was arrested here for that
violation.

What Blom did prior to coming here while on the internet and while in
Holland, was and still is irrelevant.

Nor was he arrested for what he did on the internet.

 MV>>> What if we took the same stance towards gun addicts? What if
 MV>>> Dutch cops started actively hunting gun addicts in the US? (gun
 MV>>> addicts by our definition of course) What if they started luring
 MV>>> gun addicts to come to Dutch territory and then throw them in
 MV>>> jail for being a gun addict?  What would you say if that happened
 MV>>> to a US citizen? What if it happened to a friend? Your son?

 JS>>     If someone from the US came there and broke a gun law there then
 JS>> that person should be held responsible for their actions and the
 JS>> their violation of the law there.

 MvdV> You are not answering the question. Which was what you would think
 MvdV> if Dutch cops started actively hunting American gun addicts in
 MvdV> America (like you) and lured them into Dutch jurisdiction in oredr
 MvdV> to get them behind bars?

Pray tell, how would they lure someone to come to Holland and violate
their laws?

Isn't it against the law there to entrap people, even those from the US?

 MvdV> I did not expect you to answer that because the honest answer of
 MvdV> course would be that you would not like it at all.

I'd figure that one such case as you describe would alert all Americans,
as well as others world-wide, to your country's negative attitude toward
the rights of all world citizens. Your country would suffer sanctions like
there is no tomorrow.

 MvdV> But if you admit that, you would implicitly admit that I have good
 MvdV> reason to be pissed off about what happened to Blom.

I wouldn't and I don't give a shit how you feel about it, so it's a closed
case.

                R\%/itt

Joy lives in the fight, in the attempt, in the suffering involved, not in
the victory itself.

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