Text 19174, 129 rader
Skriven 2014-11-09 17:44:50 av Lee Lofaso (2:203/2)
  Kommentar till text 19158 av Michiel van der Vlist (2:280/5555)
Ärende: Life Under the Democr
=============================
Hello Michiel,

 LL>> If global warming is being caused by greenhouse gasses, then the
 LL>> ice sheets over land would melt but not so much the ice sheets in
 LL>> the oceans.  Why?  Because two-thirds of the ice of ice sheets
 LL>> is below water,

 MvdV> Actually it is more like 9/10.

Which makes the point even clearer.

 LL>> while all of the ice on land is above water.

 MvdV> Not necesarily. A block of ice can rest on the bottom of the sea.

Of course.  But how many people can see what is underwater?

 LL>> Step 1 -
 LL>> Get a glass.  Fill it with ice, then with water up to the brim.
 LL>> As much water and ice without spilling over onto the countertop.
 LL>> Easiest to put the ice into the glass first, then the water.

 LL>> Step 2 -
 LL>> Allow ice to melt completely in the water.  Observe that no water
 LL>> spills over onto the countertop, even after all the ice has melted.

 MvdV> Archimedes already knew that. Your point?

The amount of water inside a glass, regardless of the state
it is in, will be the same amount of water.  No more, no less.
Proponents of global warming are suggesting that the atmosphere
is warming up, melting the ice that is already in the water,
raising sea levels.  Yet the ice that is on land is not melting.
Or not enough of it to make a difference.

 LL>> What is the conclusion?  Even if all the ice in Greenland and
 LL>> Antarctica were to melt, the level of the world's oceans would
 LL>> remain the same.

 MvdV> No. That the water level does not rise when the ice melts only holds for
ice
 MvdV> that floats. The North Pole ice floats. The Ice in Greenland and
Antarctice
 MvdV> rests on land.

So what is melting?  If the ice on Greenland is not melting, and the ice
on Antarctica is not melting, the cause of global warming cannot be due
to the rise of temperature in the atmosphere.

 LL>> The earth is heating up, from the inside out.

 LL>> In other words, the core of the earth is getting hotter.

 MvdV> No, it is not.

Either the earth is getting hotter, or the earth is not getting hotter.
You can't have it both ways.  Not at the same time.  So which is it?
Proponents of global warming suggest the earth is getting hotter, the
cause being the atmosphere getting hotter due to man's polluting.

Some proponents of global warming suggest the earth is getting hotter,
the cause being the earth's core heating up, not because of anything
that man has or has not done.

What is the source of global warming?  Three choices -
* atmosphere warming up
* earth's core heating up
* combination of atmosphere and core heating up

 MvdV> WHile there is a heat flow from the inside to the outside, it only
dimishes
 MvdV> with time.

Volcanoes remain very active in the world today.
New ones even crop up from time to time.

 MvdV> The heat flwo comes from two sources:

 MvdV> 1) Fossile heat. Whe3n the earth was formed some five miljard years ago,
it
 MvdV> was very hot. It slowly cooled off and now only the core is stll molten.
 MvdV> But the ccoling off in not finished. It is still cooling down.

How old is the earth?  How old is man in comparison?  The earth
has cooled down only a small fraction from what it was when man
first walked this earth.  Not even enough to notice.  For all
practical purposes the earth is just as hot today as it was when
man first came on the scene, and will remain just as hot when
man disappears completely.

 MvdV> 2) Radio-active decay. There is still some residual radio-activity from
when
 MvdV> the heavy elements were formed in the explosion of the parent stars that
 MvdV> provided all the matter that our solar system is made off. The decay
 MvdV> produces heat.

That may be.  But who cares about what happened to the stars eons ago?
I wasn't there.  You weren't either.  And I do not expect either of us
to be there when the stars finally go out, as we will both have left
the place long before then.

 MvdV> Both processes show tghe typical curve of exponential decay.

From a scientific and analytical point of view, that is nice to know.
But even then it does not really shed new light on what might be.
Some people believe global warming is caused by the earth's core
heating up.  Nobody really knows what the heck is going on at the
earth's core, as nobody has the means to measure what is going on
that far below the surface.  We can observe lava flowing out of
a volcano, and make speculations about what is going on.  But
knowing for sure is a far different matter.

 LL>> And that means Hawaii will grow.  Not only the Big Island, but
 LL>> a whole lot of new big islands.

 LL>> This also spells the end of OPEC, as America will have all the
 LL>> oil it needs for next few million years ...

 MvdV> BS.

I doubt there will be an America even a few hundred years from now.
Maybe not even a few decades from now.  And as for Holland, well, it
will have washed out to sea, just like Louisiana, within just a few
short years ...

--Lee

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