Text 1196, 141 rader
Skriven 2004-10-27 12:56:54 av Gary Wiltshire (1:379/45)
   Kommentar till text 1188 av Adam Flinton (1:379/45)
Ärende: Re: Article on WIPO & the public good
=============================================
From: "Gary Wiltshire" <gaw@sover.net>

On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 11:11:00 +0100, Adam Flinton
<adam_NO_@_SPAM_softfab.com> wrote:

> Yes there are but the concorde was crippled by external factors such as
> public opposition based on noise in the US & the military utility of a
> mach2+ long range high flying aircraft. The Concorde was making a very
> healthy profit & the numbers of people who cross the atlantic paying
> first/business class prices demonstrate the numbers involved.

Noise is part of the tradeoffs which determine practicality.  I remember NO
discussion of any "military" issues with the SST.

> Nope becuase there were widescale protests in the period when the
> production line was open wrt noise on takeoff/landing etc. The
> production line was then closed & it was uneconomic to re-open it.

Unless a quieter SST could have been produced again that shows the
impracticality of the SST.

> It is. But flying is dangerous by commercial train stds so by that
> measure commuter flights over land should be banned as being more
> dangerous than necessary.

You've got that backward.  Trains are dangerous by commercial flying standards.

> In the same way as a 3 hour trip is more bearable than an 8 hour trip &
> has the added advantage of time saved?

Only if time were the only factor.  You could be packed into a Mercury capsule
and make it to the other side of the planet if less time.  How many passengers
are doing it?

> So one of the great advances of the last 50 years is not so great
> compared to ye olde condom.

Again, Adam, apples and oranges.  The only function they share is birth
control.  You're back to apricots and your own lack of imagination.

>
>>> Indeed not. However that is to assume that all oil/(natural) gas
>>> fired  power stations use gas turbines.
>>   Overwhelmingly commonplace here.  They are efficient and easy to
>> scale up  in individual small units at need with very little advance
>> notice.
>>
>
> Maybe.

No maybe about it.  They're downright wonderful for handling changing load
conditions.  There were even attempts to scale them down to automotive
powerplants.  My grandfather, when he worked for SOHIO, had temporary custody
of a Chrysler prototype.  Materials science wasn't up to the task for cars.

> Indeed they do. However if it was just as easy to get into the US by air
> then you'd be open to not just to central american poor but global poor.

We get plenty of global poor, thank you very much.

> Because of the tight controls placed on air travel.

We don't have differential standards for poor people flying.

> No they were not. Until fairly recently China was the greatest economic
> & scientific power in the world. It was in large part the depradations
> of the West (e.g. the Opium wars) allied to their complacency which lead
> to their temporary eclipse by the west.

What China did and, for that matter much of the West as well, before Bacon's
time could not be described as "science."

> Equally the scientific & economic power house of Europe during the
> period of scientific discovery by the West was Turkey.

See above.
>
>
>> There is a considerable  difference between Scientific Method and what
>> could hardly be called  "science" in China or other backward nations.
>
> wrt to China you are simply wrong. It is just as correct to say that
> there is a considerable difference between culture & what could hardly
> be called "culture" in the US or other backward nations.

Do you even know what "Scientific Method" means?
>
> Usury is against the tenets of a great number of religions. It is
> against the tenets of Christianity too which used to account for the
> "Shylock" image of Jews as Christians were also banned from usury.

We (the west in general and Christianity in particular) got over it.  It's long
past time for Islam to as well.
>
> The fact that the west engages in usury is more to do with the decline
> in imporatnce of Christianity in the West.

I don't recall arguing in favor of Christianity.  A similar decline in the
importance of Islam in the mideast would be a similar plus.  An Enlightenment
of their own would also be nice.

>
>
>>> Yup. But the time & expense & danger involved in travelling between
>>> Rome  & Constantinople then was greater than the equivalent journey
>>> between  any 2 major cities on earth today.
>>   That's very true, but it's still a bad comparison because the two
>> were  essentially one bilingual culture with the western or "Roman"
>> part largely  built upon eastern or "Greek" models.
>>
>
> In what way is that different to the world we live in? The World Bank,
> WTO etc are basically western models which others then build upon.

YOU were attempting to paint Rome versus Constantinople as somehow equivalent
to the West versus the Third World.  You can't have it both ways.

>
> That model is in turn built upon a variety of sources including arabic
> numerics & algebra etc in the same way that english includes large
> numbers of indian words & concepts.

Actually the contribution of indian words and concepts is statistically
insignificant compared to original Anglo-Saxon, Norman French, Latin and Greek.
 As far as science and mathematics go there is a considerable difference
between the hit-or-miss trial-and-error efforts of the east years ago and
scientific method.  It is not through raiding of some secret exclusive cache of
technological information secreted by advanced third worlders that the West
quickly attained technological supremecy.

> Where western civilization is in large part built upon eastern basic
> knowledge & civilization.

Only in drips and drabs.  See above.


--
Gary Wiltshire

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