Text 1749, 260 rader
Skriven 2005-01-03 19:40:28 av Rich (1:379/45)
Kommentar till text 1748 av Geo (1:379/45)
Ärende: Re: Usage history
=========================
From: "Rich" <@>
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I do trust some of my phones to store info. I don't have my phone =
store the info that concerns me that businesses with whom I deal will =
protect. My computer doesn't store that either. I can ensure the = latter
because I have control of my computer and what it saves. Same = for my
telephones.
You aren't answering my questions. I suspect it is because they =
point out that you can't defend the claims you are making.
Rich
"Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message news:41da0bfb$1@w3.nls.net...
But do you trust your telephone to store your information or are you =
required to provide that information via the telephone? There is a =
difference, if your telephone recorded your CC number and would play it = back
whenever someone hit the correct 3 digit number sequence, how would = that
change your view of that secure telephone?
I don't think people have a problem with using a computer to purchase =
stuff, they just have a problem (or are learning to have a problem) with = the
computer remembering too much sensitive information.
Try thinking of both the telephone and the computer as simple =
communications devices, they really are quite similar in that regard.
Geo.
"Rich" <@> wrote in message news:41d98d5e@w3.nls.net...
I still disagree. You are mixing trust in the computer and trust =
in the content viewed with the computer. I don't trust telemarketers = but I
do not confuse that with trust of the telephone. I'm sure you = make the
latter distinction. Don't you make the former? You have made = plenty of
claims in this groups that indicate that you do.
If you think people should be afraid of folks listening in then =
you should be encouraging folks to fear their ISPs. That is the = analogous
scenario. Your telephone analogy is a bad one because people = have been
exploited by folks listening in on mobile phones and maybe = land lines too.
Someone else claimed a paranoid fear of law enforcement = which has a long
history of listening to phone conversations. Now my = concerns are very
different from yours. I don't fear someone listening = to me communicating a
CC number or other PII. My concern is the = business to which I communicate it
doesn't protect the information. = There are plenty of examples of this. Try
asking your bank if they can =
tell you which of their employees has seen your SSN and when?
Rich
"Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:41d92728$1@w3.nls.net...
"Rich" <@> wrote in message news:41d891c8$1@w3.nls.net...
>> I disagree with your conclusion and even more with the =
suggestion that
your example supports it. In fact your story argues against your
conclusion. People do trust their computers and the web sites =
they visit
and the email they receive. If they did not many problems these =
people
encounter would not exist as they rely on the users trusting =
something they
should not.<<
That is what proves my point, I said people are learning not to =
trust their
computers, they learn this by getting rooted or getting infected =
by an email
attachment.
>> When using the Internet, of all the components to trust, the =
PC is the
one most worthy of trust as it is the only one over which you =
have any
control. Even non-techical users have control as you do not need =
to
understand how things work to control them (e.g. TV). <<
There is a difference between trusting a computer like you trust a =
telephone
and trusting it like you would trust someone with your credit =
card. I have
no problem telling a vendor my CC number over the telephone =
because it's
unlikely someone is listening in, I do have a problem with =
allowing the
telephone to remember my CC number because it's not a device I =
trust to be
secure with storing that sort of information.
Geo.
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> I do trust some of my =
phones to store=20
info. I don't have my phone store the info that concerns me that=20
businesses with whom I deal will protect. My computer doesn't = store
that=20
either. I can ensure the latter because I have control of my = computer
and=20
what it saves. Same for my telephones.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> You aren't answering my=20
questions. I suspect it is because they point out that you can't =
defend=20
the claims you are making.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Geo" <<A =
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>> wrote=20
in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41da0bfb$1@w3.nls.net">news:41da0bfb$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>But do you trust your telephone to =
store your=20
information or are you required to provide that information via the =
telephone?=20
There is a difference, if your telephone recorded your CC number and =
would=20
play it back whenever someone hit the correct 3 digit number sequence, =
how=20
would that change your view of that secure telephone?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I don't think people have a problem =
with using a=20
computer to purchase stuff, they just have a problem (or are =
learning to=20
have a problem) with the computer remembering too much sensitive=20
information.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Try thinking of both the telephone =
and the=20
computer as simple communications devices, they really are quite =
similar in=20
that regard.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Rich" <@> wrote in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41d98d5e@w3.nls.net">news:41d98d5e@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> I still =
disagree. You are=20
mixing trust in the computer and trust in the content viewed with =
the=20
computer. I don't trust telemarketers but I do not confuse =
that with=20
trust of the telephone. I'm sure you make the latter=20
distinction. Don't you make the former? You have made =
plenty of=20
claims in this groups that indicate that you do.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> If you think people =
should be=20
afraid of folks listening in then you should be encouraging folks to =
fear=20
their ISPs. That is the analogous scenario. Your =
telephone=20
analogy is a bad one because people have been exploited by folks =
listening=20
in on mobile phones and maybe land lines too. Someone else =
claimed a=20
paranoid fear of law enforcement which has a long history of =
listening to=20
phone conversations. Now my concerns are very different from=20
yours. I don't fear someone listening to me communicating a CC =
number=20
or other PII. My concern is the business to which I =
communicate it=20
doesn't protect the information. There are plenty of examples =
of=20
this. Try asking your bank if they can tell you which of =
their=20
employees has seen your SSN and when?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Geo" <<A =
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>>=20
wrote in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41d92728$1@w3.nls.net">news:41d92728$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>"Rich"=20
<@> wrote in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:41d891c8$1@w3.nls.net">news:41d891c8$1@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR>=
>> =20
I disagree with your conclusion and even more with the suggestion=20
that<BR>your example supports it. In fact your story argues =
against=20
your<BR>conclusion. People do trust their computers and the =
web=20
sites they visit<BR>and the email they receive. If they did =
not many=20
problems these people<BR>encounter would not exist as they rely on =
the=20
users trusting something they<BR>should not.<<<BR><BR>That =
is what=20
proves my point, I said people are learning not to trust=20
their<BR>computers, they learn this by getting rooted or getting =
infected=20
by an email<BR>attachment.<BR><BR>>> When using =
the=20
Internet, of all the components to trust, the PC is the<BR>one =
most worthy=20
of trust as it is the only one over which you have=20
any<BR>control. Even non-techical users have control as you =
do not=20
need to<BR>understand how things work to control them (e.g.=20
TV). <<<BR><BR>There is a difference between trusting =
a=20
computer like you trust a telephone<BR>and trusting it like you =
would=20
trust someone with your credit card. I have<BR>no problem telling =
a vendor=20
my CC number over the telephone because it's<BR>unlikely someone =
is=20
listening in, I do have a problem with allowing the<BR>telephone =
to=20
remember my CC number because it's not a device I trust to =
be<BR>secure=20
with storing that sort of=20
=
information.<BR><BR>Geo.<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></=
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