Text 2107, 299 rader
Skriven 2005-01-21 06:24:10 av Geo (1:379/45)
   Kommentar till text 2105 av Rich (1:379/45)
Ärende: Re: Do we protect users from their own stupidity?
=========================================================
From: "Geo" <georger@nls.net>

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Say you have a customer who is having some problem getting emails from = an
email list or they keep getting the same email over and over again or = they
got an email hours after it was sent and want to know why or any of = a dozen
other reasons where you need to see information that most email = programs now
hide.

interesting idea of saving the message, changing the extension then = attaching
it to a new email, I may try that one although that still may = be a bit much
to explain to some people.

Geo.

"Rich" <@> wrote in message news:41f087ab@w3.nls.net...
     What kind of email issue?  The encoded body parts only matter to me =
when I suspect there is a problem with the encoding in the sending app.

     OE forward is fine.  Use Forward As Attachment.  Outlook will do =
this but you have to select two or more messages, forward, then delete = the
extra.  There may be a simpler way but I know this one works.  Still = you
still won't get what you want from any email program because the = RFCs have
specific rules regarding an embedded RFC822 encoded message = that may mandate
re-encoding parts of it.  If I'm really concerned I = have people save the
message, rename it with some non-message extension, = then attach the renamed
file.

  Rich
    "Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:41f04260$1@w3.nls.net...
    Yes, pretty much any time you have an email issue you need to solve, =
you have to be able to look at the raw message in it's entirety or be = able to
cut/paste it into another email so you can forward it to someone = so they can
see it in it's original form.

    The way outlook and outlook express "forward" feature works it is =
virtually useless to forward an email to tech support because all the =
important parts are either removed or modified. ISP techs and = postmasters
walk people thru this copying the raw email to a new email = procedure all the
time.

    As an end user you probably wouldn't need it except if you were a =
geek but for support purposes it's quite common.

    Geo.
      "Rich" <@> wrote in message news:41ef296e$1@w3.nls.net...
         Outlook is not limited to RFC822 format nor is this the native =
format.  What you describe is RFC822 specific and assumes that the = RFC822
format is the storage format.

         Do you really view the headers and the encoded body parts as =
something you view for the same reasons?

      Rich

        "Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:41ef23a8$1@w3.nls.net...
        I like the outlook express view source feature better than that. =
It allows me to see the headers and the source of the message all in one =
window and I can get to that window without ever opening the email. = Really
wish I could do that in Outlook. (I'm running Outlook 2000 but it = doesn't
sound like the current version is much improved wrt this = feature)

        Geo.
          "Rich" <@> wrote in message news:41ef13a2$1@w3.nls.net...
             The headers, all headers for both the message and all the =
MIME parts.

          Rich

            "Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:41eef749$2@w3.nls.net...
            does that show you just the headers or is it like OE view =
source where it shows the whole raw email all in one screen?

            Geo.
              "Rich" <@> wrote in message news:41edbbb8@w3.nls.net...
                 Full headers, yes.  In the options dialog.

              Rich

                "Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:41eda613@w3.nls.net...
                In the current version of Outlook, is there a way to =
view the source for an email without opening the email first like you = can do
in Outlook express?=20

                Geo.

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<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Say you have a customer who is having =
some problem=20
getting emails from an email list or they keep getting the same email = over
and=20
over again or they got an email hours after it was sent and want to know = why
or=20
any of a dozen other reasons where you need to see information that most =
email=20
programs now hide.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>interesting idea of saving the message, =
changing=20
the extension then attaching it to a new email, I may try that one = although
that=20
still may be a bit much to explain to some people.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>"Rich" &lt;@&gt; wrote in message <A=20
href=3D"news:41f087ab@w3.nls.net">news:41f087ab@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; What kind of email =
issue?&nbsp; The=20
  encoded body parts only matter to me when I suspect there is a problem =
with=20
  the encoding in the sending app.</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; OE forward is =
fine.&nbsp; Use=20
  Forward As Attachment.&nbsp; Outlook will do this but you have to =
select two=20
  or more messages, forward, then delete the extra.&nbsp; There may be a =
simpler=20
  way but I know this one works.&nbsp; Still you still won't get what =
you want=20
  from any email program because the RFCs have specific rules regarding =
an=20
  embedded RFC822 encoded message that may mandate re-encoding parts of=20
  it.&nbsp; If I'm really concerned I have people save the message, =
rename it=20
  with some non-message extension, then attach the renamed =
file.</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
  <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
  style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
    <DIV>"Geo" &lt;<A =
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>&gt;=20
    wrote in message <A=20
    =
href=3D"news:41f04260$1@w3.nls.net">news:41f04260$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Yes, pretty much any time you have =
an email=20
    issue you need to solve, you have to be able to look at the raw =
message in=20
    it's entirety or be able to cut/paste it into another email so you =
can=20
    forward it to someone so they can see it in it's original =
form.</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The way outlook and outlook express =
"forward"=20
    feature works it is virtually useless to forward an email to tech =
support=20
    because all the important parts are either removed or modified. ISP =
techs=20
    and postmasters walk people thru this copying the raw email to a new =
email=20
    procedure all the time.</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>As an end user you probably =
wouldn't need it=20
    except if you were a geek but for support purposes it's quite=20
    common.</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
    <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
    style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
      <DIV>"Rich" &lt;@&gt; wrote in message <A=20
      =
href=3D"news:41ef296e$1@w3.nls.net">news:41ef296e$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; Outlook is not =
limited to RFC822=20
      format nor is this the native format.&nbsp; What you describe is =
RFC822=20
      specific and assumes that the RFC822 format is the storage=20
      format.</FONT></DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; Do you really view =
the headers=20
      and the encoded body parts as something you view for the same=20
      reasons?</FONT></DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
      <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
      style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
        <DIV>"Geo" &lt;<A =
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>&gt;=20
        wrote in message <A=20
        =
href=3D"news:41ef23a8$1@w3.nls.net">news:41ef23a8$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
        <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I like the outlook express view =
source=20
        feature better than that. It allows me to see the headers and =
the source=20
        of the message all in one window and I can get to that window =
without=20
        ever opening the email. Really wish I could do that in Outlook. =
(I'm=20
        running Outlook 2000 but it doesn't sound like the current =
version is=20
        much improved wrt this feature)</FONT></DIV>
        <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
        <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
        <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
        style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
          <DIV>"Rich" &lt;@&gt; wrote in message <A=20
          =
href=3D"news:41ef13a2$1@w3.nls.net">news:41ef13a2$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; The headers, all =
headers for=20
          both the message and all the MIME parts.</FONT></DIV>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
          <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
          <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
          style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
            <DIV>"Geo" &lt;<A=20
            href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>&gt; =
wrote in=20
            message <A=20
            =
href=3D"news:41eef749$2@w3.nls.net">news:41eef749$2@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>
            <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>does that show you just the =
headers or=20
            is it like OE view source where it shows the whole raw email =
all in=20
            one screen?</FONT></DIV>
            <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
            <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
            <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
            style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: =
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
              <DIV>"Rich" &lt;@&gt; wrote in message <A=20
              =
href=3D"news:41edbbb8@w3.nls.net">news:41edbbb8@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
              <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; Full =
headers, yes.&nbsp;=20
              In the options dialog.</FONT></DIV>
              <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
              <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
              <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
              <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
              style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
                <DIV>"Geo" &lt;<A=20
                href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>&gt; =
wrote in=20
                message <A=20
                =
href=3D"news:41eda613@w3.nls.net">news:41eda613@w3.nls.net</A>...</DIV>
                <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>In the current version =
of Outlook,=20
                is there a way to view the source for an email without =
opening=20
                the email first like you can do in Outlook express?=20
</FONT></DIV>
                <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
                <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Geo.</FONT></DIV>
                =
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BL=
OCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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