Text 6753, 352 rader
Skriven 2005-08-27 13:13:40 av Rich (1:379/45)
Kommentar till text 6752 av Robert Comer (1:379/45)
Ärende: Re: TPM
===============
From: "Rich" <@>
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I disagree.
What are the negatives of having a TPM?
Do you have or have you seen a recent thinkpad with one? How about a =
recent toshiba laptop? Are these lesser devices because of it?
Rich
"Robert Comer" <bobcomer@mindspring.com> wrote in message =
news:4310c52a$1@w3.nls.net...
> You don't have to use a TPM even if your computer has one.
Right now, yes, but in the future, I doubt that it's going to be =
optional.=20
Look at the beta x86 OSX -- it requires a specific TPM.
>If you just want a smartcard you could have had one for years.
I didn't say I wanted one, just that I maybe could live with in place =
of=20
TPM.
>A TPM builtin provides other benefits.
And negatives as well.
- Bob Comer
"Rich" <@> wrote in message news:4310abaa@w3.nls.net...
You don't have to use a TPM even if your computer has one. If you =
just=20
want a smartcard you could have had one for years. A TPM builtin =
provides=20
other benefits.
Rich
"Robert Comer" <bobcomer@mindspring.com> wrote in message=20
news:43108b95$1@w3.nls.net...
> VT is virtualization.
Yep, know that, it's my specialty.
>LT is security. Neither is what george likes to call DRM.
True.
>What he tries to spin as something sinister is the smart card like
>functionality (e.g. secure storage, hardware crypto) >provided by a =
TPM
>chip.
That's the one I don't like. A smartcard idea I maybe could live =
with,=20
but
it would have to be both optional for the OS and machine, and =
portable
between machines. Like a key basically, I carry it to whatever =
machine I
happen to be using it at the time, rather than it being tied to a =
specific
piece of hardware, and you should have the ability to own more than =
just=20
one
key.
- Bob Comer
"Rich" <@> wrote in message news:430ff6af@w3.nls.net...
VT is virtualization. LT is security. Neither is what george =
likes to
call DRM. What he tries to spin as something sinister is the smart =
card
like functionality (e.g. secure storage, hardware crypto) provided =
by a=20
TPM
chip.
Rich
"Robert Comer" <bobcomer@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:430fdaf8$1@w3.nls.net...
Yep, it looks like it's coming, probably not anything we can do =
about it
either -- it's for the masses to decide about.
For now, no DRM media stuff for me at all, I refuse to use it. I =
don't=20
do
any media other than broadcast TV on my PC. I'll probably get a =
new
processor soon, with VT, dual or quad core, and yes, DRM, but that =
doesn't
mean I have to allow the DRM part to make any difference to what I =
want=20
to
do.
Eventually there will probably be some computer/OS company that =
will
emerge
to satisfy our computing needs, but for entertainment, we're =
screwed=20
until
everyone else catches up and they revolt.
- Bob Comer
"Geo" <georger@nls.net> wrote in message =
news:430fbaa3$1@w3.nls.net...
> All this DRM crap is nothing but a power grab so that technology
companies
> can enforce more restrictions on how we use technology in order =
to
extort
> more money for the same shit.
>
> Once it becomes possible to prevent you from upgrading your OS =
without
> upgrading your computer, or to prevent you from upgrading your=20
computer
> without upgrading your OS, do you really think Intel or MS will =
be=20
able
to
> resist the temptation? Do you think a computer sold with windows =
should
> allow the user to remove windows and install Linux cause I =
somehow=20
think
> that's the kind of limitations we are headed for.
>
> Intel is going to have to include that type of tech to make =
Apple=20
happy,
> especially in light of the recent news that OSX was running on =
non=20
Apple
> PC's already...
>
> Geo.
>
> "Robert Comer" <bobcomer@mindspring.com> wrote in message
> news:430eed74@w3.nls.net...
>> I don't know if any do yet, but they agreed to do drm hardware =
for
> palladium
>> just like intel did.
>>
>> - Bob Comer
>
>
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> I disagree.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> What are the negatives of =
having a=20
TPM?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> Do you have or have you =
seen a recent=20
thinkpad with one? How about a recent toshiba laptop? Are =
these=20
lesser devices because of it?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rich</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Robert Comer" <<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:bobcomer@mindspring.com">bobcomer@mindspring.com</A>> = wrote
in=20
message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:4310c52a$1@w3.nls.net">news:4310c52a$1@w3.nls.net</A>...</DI=
V>> =20
You don't have to use a TPM even if your computer has =
one.<BR><BR>Right now,=20
yes, but in the future, I doubt that it's going to be optional. =
<BR>Look at=20
the beta x86 OSX -- it requires a specific TPM.<BR><BR>>If =
you just=20
want a smartcard you could have had one for years.<BR><BR>I didn't say =
I=20
wanted one, just that I maybe could live with in place of=20
<BR>TPM.<BR><BR>>A TPM builtin provides other benefits.<BR><BR>And=20
negatives as well.<BR><BR>- Bob Comer<BR><BR><BR>"Rich" <@> =
wrote in=20
message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:4310abaa@w3.nls.net">news:4310abaa@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR>&nbs=
p; =20
You don't have to use a TPM even if your computer has one. If =
you just=20
<BR>want a smartcard you could have had one for years. A TPM =
builtin=20
provides <BR>other benefits.<BR><BR>Rich<BR><BR> "Robert Comer" =
<<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:bobcomer@mindspring.com">bobcomer@mindspring.com</A>> = wrote
in=20
message <BR><A=20
=
href=3D"news:43108b95$1@w3.nls.net">news:43108b95$1@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR>=
=20
> VT is virtualization.<BR><BR> Yep, know that, =
it's my=20
specialty.<BR><BR> >LT is security. Neither is what =
george=20
likes to call DRM.<BR><BR> True.<BR><BR> >What he tries =
to spin=20
as something sinister is the smart card like<BR> =
>functionality (e.g.=20
secure storage, hardware crypto) >provided by a TPM<BR> =20
>chip.<BR><BR> That's the one I don't like. A =
smartcard=20
idea I maybe could live with, <BR>but<BR> it would have to be =
both=20
optional for the OS and machine, and portable<BR> between=20
machines. Like a key basically, I carry it to whatever machine=20
I<BR> happen to be using it at the time, rather than it being =
tied to a=20
specific<BR> piece of hardware, and you should have the ability =
to own=20
more than just <BR>one<BR> key.<BR><BR> - Bob=20
Comer<BR><BR><BR> "Rich" <@> wrote in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:430ff6af@w3.nls.net">news:430ff6af@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR>&nbs=
p; =20
VT is virtualization. LT is security. Neither is what =
george likes=20
to<BR> call DRM. What he tries to spin as something =
sinister is=20
the smart card<BR> like functionality (e.g. secure storage, =
hardware=20
crypto) provided by a <BR>TPM<BR> chip.<BR><BR> =20
Rich<BR><BR> "Robert Comer" <<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:bobcomer@mindspring.com">bobcomer@mindspring.com</A>> = wrote
in=20
message<BR> <A=20
=
href=3D"news:430fdaf8$1@w3.nls.net">news:430fdaf8$1@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR>=
=20
Yep, it looks like it's coming, probably not anything we can do about=20
it<BR> either -- it's for the masses to decide=20
about.<BR><BR> For now, no DRM media stuff for me at =
all, I=20
refuse to use it. I don't <BR>do<BR> any media =
other=20
than broadcast TV on my PC. I'll probably get a=20
new<BR> processor soon, with VT, dual or quad core, =
and yes,=20
DRM, but that <BR>doesn't<BR> mean I have to allow =
the DRM=20
part to make any difference to what I want =
<BR>to<BR> =20
do.<BR><BR> Eventually there will probably be some=20
computer/OS company that will<BR> emerge<BR> =
to=20
satisfy our computing needs, but for entertainment, we're screwed=20
<BR>until<BR> everyone else catches up and they=20
revolt.<BR><BR> - Bob=20
Comer<BR><BR><BR><BR> "Geo" <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:georger@nls.net">georger@nls.net</A>> wrote in =
message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:430fbaa3$1@w3.nls.net">news:430fbaa3$1@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR>=
=20
> All this DRM crap is nothing but a power grab so that=20
technology<BR> companies<BR> > can enforce =
more=20
restrictions on how we use technology in order to<BR> =20
extort<BR> > more money for the same=20
shit.<BR> ><BR> > Once it =
becomes=20
possible to prevent you from upgrading your OS =
without<BR> =20
> upgrading your computer, or to prevent you from upgrading your=20
<BR>computer<BR> > without upgrading your OS, do =
you=20
really think Intel or MS will be <BR>able<BR> =
to<BR> =20
> resist the temptation? Do you think a computer sold with windows=20
<BR>should<BR> > allow the user to remove windows =
and=20
install Linux cause I somehow <BR>think<BR> > =
that's the=20
kind of limitations we are headed for.<BR> =20
><BR> > Intel is going to have to include that =
type of=20
tech to make Apple <BR>happy,<BR> > especially in =
light=20
of the recent news that OSX was running on non =
<BR>Apple<BR> =20
> PC's already...<BR> ><BR> =
>=20
Geo.<BR> ><BR> > "Robert =
Comer"=20
<<A =
href=3D"mailto:bobcomer@mindspring.com">bobcomer@mindspring.com</A>>=20
wrote in message<BR> > <A=20
=
href=3D"news:430eed74@w3.nls.net">news:430eed74@w3.nls.net</A>...<BR>&nbs=
p; =20
>> I don't know if any do yet, but they agreed to do drm =
hardware=20
for<BR> > palladium<BR> =
>> just=20
like intel did.<BR> >><BR> =
>>=20
- Bob Comer<BR> ><BR> =20
><BR><BR><BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
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