Text 17053, 213 rader
Skriven 2007-08-14 14:22:33 av Duggy (3530.babylon5)
  Kommentar till text 16776 av rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.moderated (3253.babylon5)
Ärende: Re: LONG LIVE BABYLON 5.
================================
On Aug 5, 2:06 pm, "Mac Breck" <macthevor...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > Only if you don't understand the process of the creation of fiction.
> Oh, and you do, I guess?

I know a little.

> > The point of Crusade was not the timeline.
> That statement doesn't make any sense.

The point of Babylon 5 was not the timeline.  It was to tell certain
stories.

If at the end of season 2, JMS had been told that season 3 was the
last he would have picked the stories he needed to tell have done
that.  The five years was just the best way to tell them.  Not the
only way.

The timeline is not the point.

> > The point of Crusade was not the Darkh plague.
> No, we all know that Crusade was not going to be a five year search for
> the cure to the Drakh plague.

Exactly.

>  Then, it was going to morph into a show about
> Earthforce black projects using shadowtech, and the mages.

OK.  Ancient tech being used by the current races.

Now let's look at the plot to the LotR pilot... a new ancient race
handing out ancient tech to the current races...

But no.  LotR isn't a new way to tell the Crusade stories.

Because, well, the name's different for a start, right?

> > Which LotR introduced.
> I keep trying to forget TLaDiS.

Clearly you have forgotten it.

> > > > It's been too long to bring back LotR, too, I think.
> > > If so, thank god for small mercies.  Still, I;d like to see some of
> > > those characters back (Dulann, Na'Feel [unfortunate name, I know]),
> > > Firell and ~maybe~ David Martel).
> > None of them interest me enough to *need* to see again.
> Maybe not *need* but it'd be nice to see Dulann, at least.

Hey, cool, you want to see Dulann again, cool.  I'm just saying I
don't care enough to fight for it.

> > If it works for the bigger story, sure,
> Well, that goes without saying.

And I feel that G'Karr in LotR didn't.

Well, he did until the end when he started referencing B5.

> Crusade isn't solely about the Drakh plague.

The Crusade we saw was.  If you did a telemovie, episode of another
series that ended the Drakh plague or a TLT story, then Crusade is
finished.

The story Crusade was to tell isn't, finished by doing that, but then
JMS tried to tell those stories by introducing the major elements into
LotR.

Thus circumventing the need for more Crusade.

> I want to see them get into the Earthforce black projects stuff,

Like  LotR would have done?

> and the mages, *not* just find the cure to the plague.

Which would have brought closure to Crusade.

> For the most part, they had a very good cast
> for Crusade.  I want to see those characters/actors continue.

I don't remember the cast too well.  I do remember that the characters
were a cliche AD&D party of adventures (the fighter, the thief, the
wizard, the psionist, et c.) and for that reason they bored me.

However, if you liked the characters fair enough.

Do you think they work a characters or do they need the combined cast
to work?

I mean, as characters bleed away from B5 the show (and telemovies)
worked less and less.  Same with The West Wing.

Do you think that, say, TLT stories based around individual Crusade
characters would give you your fix, or do you need the "entire crew of
the Excaliber"?

> I disagree.  With so much time between Lost Tales DVDs, it's going to be
> next to impossible to carry on a continuing storyline.

True.  With any luck TLT will become successful and he can start to
make them in sets of 3 to 6 installments... say, make 3 Crusade
stories all at once, and then make the related TLT stories which tie
in.

> A series is what's needed to do that kind of thing, not one DVD every six
> months to a year (if we're lucky).

And without the ongoing stories a lot of interest will be lost.
Making TLT less successful, meaning the time between the stories will
be longer... making a lot of interest lost... yeah, TLT isn't the
answer.

> I like to see projects *finished*, not lots of projects started but never
finished.

I can understand that.

> Raising Crusade from the dead
> would give them a chance to *correct* the damage TNT did, and turn a
> black eye into a success.

I'm talking about finishing a story.  You're talking about pay-back.

Two totally different things.

> The Hand needs to be *forgotten*.  In fact, as far as I'm concerned,
> TLaDiS never happened.

The story of The Hand needs to be finished.  As does the story of the
Drakh plague.  I'm not a fan of retconning something just because you
don't like it.

> That was by far the worst 88 minutes of a B5
> universe show that I've ever seen.

I can't go that far.

> A good deal of it (e.g. the weapons
> thing, and all of Sarah's lines/scenes) was painful to watch.

Agreed.

The Hand wasn't great, but it wasn't the thing that killed the
episode.  It is still salvagable.


> > Perhaps, what it needs is to be a cable or UK series.  Shorter seasons
> > [or series in the UK] and thus cheaper.
> Cheaper per season, but not per episode,

Agreed.

> and all  that means is that it'll take more seasons to tell the story.

I can't agree.  Let's look at a HBO & some UK 13 episode season... cf
Babylon 5's 22 episode seasons...

You're saying that there aren't 9 episodes that can be shaved of many
season of B5 and still tell the complete story?

Sure, the 6 - 10 episode of some UK shows would take longer to tell
the story... and thus more dangerous... but I think that 13 episodes
would work.

> > Also, I find that a 6, 10, 13 episode UK or cable series is tighter
> > with less Grey 13 type episodes.
> Grey 17 is Missing

17 is too close to US numbers of episodes... if 17, why not 22?

> > Lost Tales does have the ability to tell only stories that need to be
> > told, sure, but is possibly less satisfying than a series
> *Definitely* less satisfying than a series.

I concur.

> > (and, I
> > can't see that it would be cheaper per  story than a series)
> Well almost anything they make for The Lost Tales could also be used for
> a series.  That spreads the costs around.

If they store everything.

> > but I'm willing to give it a try.
> So am I, but I think we also need a series to tell these longer stories.

Agreed.  I just don't think that that series needs to be Crusade or
LotR.

You don't need either to tell those stories.

> > You wouldn't need the original actors if you didn't redo Crusade.
> That's true, but in Crusade, they had a good group that was just
> starting to gel.  It would be a crime to lose that forever, to lose
> those characters.

I disagree, but, that's how these things work.

> > >  The sole bright spot in this whole thing is that
> > > it looks like they've found a good effects house to recreate all the
> > > CGI.  Those space shots in B5-TLT were amazing.
> > Dunno, not in the right country.
> September is coming.

Aye.

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